AR Options

[FALPhil]

With all the panic buying going on these days, I had not planned to
participate until a brand new AR lower fell into my lap for slightly
over $100. I had an extra lower build out kit, so I assembled it,
using the excellent CAA 6-position collapsible stock.

Now, the question is, what style of carbine upper? The way I see it,
my options are

1. An M4gery upper from akpartskits.com. It has a 16 inch barrel with
1:9 twist on an LMT A2 style upper. $330 and no bolt assembly or
charging handle.

2. An A3 upper from akpartskits.com. It has a 16 inch barrel with no
grenade launcher cut on an LMT flattop style upper and 1:9 twist with
an A2 style front sight. $290 and no bolt assembly or charging handle.

3. CMMG M18M SPR Upper. It has an 18 inch heavy barrel with a rifle
length gas system, 1:8 twist, and is a "dissipator" configuration with
a rifle length sight radius. It comes with a flattop upper, but can be
uipgraded to an A2 upper for $25. It also comes with the bolt assembly
and charging handle. Total is $625.

The CMMG is my favorite option, but I wonder if the carbine will be
very front-heavy with the barrel that is 0.875 inches behind the gas
block. I like the idea of the extra 2 inches for velocity sake, and
the heavy barrel for heat dissipation and stiffness. OTOH, the other
two options will be a lot lighter.

The other issue is that I know that CMMG is quality. I have lots of
friends that have CMMG uppers and guns, and all are very satisfied. I
don't know a lot about akpartskits.com, except that they use LMT
forged uppers, and barrels from Wilson and Mossberg. They are run by
a company called Blackthorn, which is, IIRC, a subsidiary of Hesse.
My one experience with a Hesse product (stainless FAL receiver) has
been wonderful, but, I have read of a host of problems that other
people have had.

If it makes any difference, my other AR is a Bushmaster, and I would
expect at least the same performance from this carbine as I would for
my Bushy.

So, what do you guys think?

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Well, just in terms of actual equipment, I liked option #3 the best out of those even without considering the source of the parts. Now add in the fact that you have a choice of either CMMG or a company that has had to change its name multiple times in order to escape its past reputation and it seems like #3 is a clear winner to me.

On being front heavy, a proper M4 profiled barrel (is choice #1 a proper M4 profile barrel or only M4-profile outside the handguards?) should be about 2.2lbs for a 16" (includes barrel nut, delta ring, etc.)

The CMMG is my favorite option, but I wonder if the carbine will be
very front-heavy with the barrel that is 0.875 inches behind the gas
block.

IIRC, the actual SPR barrel steps from about 1" to .85" to .75" (rough numbers). For comparison, a typical 16" HBAR is about 1" underneath the handguards and .75" forward (and weighs in at 2.7lbs).

Naturally, you are going to notice an extra half pound in front of the barrel nut (likely a little more depending on the exact profile of the CMMG 18") - now whether or not you are going to feel that is too nose heavy or not, I couldn't say. I don't care for the balance of the SIG 556; but lots of people have no trouble with it.

 

[strat81]

Why are those your only options?? What about Del-Ton, BravoCo, J&T, Stag, Bushmaster, etc.?

Anyway, given those choices, CMMG every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

I'd run, not walk, away from anything associated with Blackthorn/Hesse/Vulcan.

 

[bedlamite]

From http://akpartskits.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6_17&products_id=309

This upper receiver is complete less bolt/carrier assembly and charging handle. The upper is fully assembled, headspaced, and ready for action. Drop in your bolt/carrier and charging handle and let her rip!

I wasn't aware you could check the headspace without the bolt

 

[T.A.Sharps]

What is wrong with Blackthorn? People always swear on their life against a certain brand on here, but never say why really.

 

[FALPhil]

Strat81, these re the only two vendors that I could find that were not backordered.

 

[Alleykat]

I wasn't aware you could check the headspace without the bolt

Wouldn't you imagine that an in-spec bolt was used for headspace checking? Of maybe go/no-go gages? Every AR barrel that I've seen advertised with the barrel extension installed has already been headspaced.

 

[TheManHimself]

Vulcan/Hesse/Blackthorne is absolute garbage; why do you think they've had to change names three times? Avoid them like the plague; CMMG may not be Noveske but they're miles above Blackthorne's dremel-armed monkeys.

 

[strat81]

Strat81, these re the only two vendors that I could find that were not backordered.

I see.

While I understand that everyone's wants and needs are different, I politely and strongly recommend you consider waiting and getting exactly what you want from a quality vendor. You'll be happier in the end when you have a quality product that meets your needs and expectations, rather than settling for what is around.

If you want a fighting rifle, I'd get on Bravo Company's notify list for their 16" mid-length uppers and get one of those. They release batches somewhat frequently.

There's always Gun Broker, too. Bring cash, some of the prices are nuts there.

 

[OlympicArmsFan]

I built on an Essential Arms lower with a Black Thorn M4 full upper and no problems with it. I also have a video on youtube.com if you go on youtube type in AR-15 Black Thorn mine is the only one on there or atleast the one that has Black Thorn in it.

I shot wolf threw it and came home cleaned it really good and it wasnt as dirty as I thought it would be but then again I didnt shoot but 3 mags. I didnt have enough ammo to waste. I also didnt baby the gun either.

If you do buy a full upper from akpartskits.com ask them about the bolt carrier if you buy it this way make sure you get the shrouded one.

 

[22_Shooter]

What is wrong with Blackthorn? People always swear on their life against a certain brand on here, but never say why really.

Blackthorn/Hesse/Vulcan/Velocity Firearms are all the same. They put out garbage product.

There was a thread on THR recently, about a recently purchased lower from Blackthorn..........the lower completely snapped off at the rear.

That's what's wrong with Blackthorn.

 

[DaveInPA]

How much are you willing to spend? I just ordered one of these:

http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=100

Should be about a 4 week wait. I'm pretty excited to see how she performs. Pricey, but from everything I've read, well worth it.

 

[FALPhil]

Dave, that LaRue shore is purty, but it is way along the diminishing returns curve for what I am looking for. I already have a precision HB varmint upper.

 

[Rifleman 173]

The great thing about the AR modular rifle system is all the uppers you can mount on top of a single lower half. Pick a caliber and somebody somewhere probably makes an upper that will fit on an AR lower.

204 Ruger caliber uppers. .223/5.56 uppers. 7.62 X 39 uppers. 6.8 SPC uppers. The list goes on and on.

Don't forget that you can also get uppers from Superior Arms and Model "1" too.