Anyone seen public enemies? wanted to I.D. one of the rifles
- Thread starter epic4444
- Start date
+ on the Mauser Gewehr 1898 Sporter
I have seen one but never shot one, I did like the movie also but the camera work just sucked. Too much of the movie was done with hand held cameras and it was to dark.(Which did help the flash of the Thompson’s)
Over all it was good and the gun work and sound was extremely well done. Even my wife who has been to Knob creek gun shoot said she could finally tell a movie that the sound of the guns seemed to match the guns firing.
I have seen one but never shot one, I did like the movie also but the camera work just sucked. Too much of the movie was done with hand held cameras and it was to dark.(Which did help the flash of the Thompson’s)
Over all it was good and the gun work and sound was extremely well done. Even my wife who has been to Knob creek gun shoot said she could finally tell a movie that the sound of the guns seemed to match the guns firing.
I agree the camera work wasnt the best. I guess they were going for the realistic viewpoint? But I had to move to the rear of the theater b/c the motion was too fast in certain sceenes and I wanted to pay more attention to details that I seemed to be missing in the gun battles.
Pretty neat link with weapons confiscated from Dillingers gang
http://www.auto-ordnance.com/AO-3F3.html
Pretty neat link with weapons confiscated from Dillingers gang
http://www.auto-ordnance.com/AO-3F3.html
Willie Lowman
New member
What is the mag fed rifle in the top right of that Dillinger collection pic?
johnwilliamson062
Moderator
Incredible. I just thought that was a custom safety.
On double set triggers, pulling the rear trigger serves to cock the trigger and pulling the front trigger releases the spring loaded rear trigger allowing it to release the sear on the bolt.
Double set triggers have fallen out of favor because, while they allow a super light release, they also increase locktime. When you pull the trigger, it releases a little hammer which strikes the trigger that releases the big hammer that strikes the primer.
Gewehr is German for gun or rifle.
Double set triggers have fallen out of favor because, while they allow a super light release, they also increase locktime. When you pull the trigger, it releases a little hammer which strikes the trigger that releases the big hammer that strikes the primer.
Gewehr is German for gun or rifle.
Winchester_73
New member
When I saw the movie, I did wonder what type of rifle it was. I thought it resembled a Mannlicher-Schönauer rifle due to the 'butter knife' bolt, the beautiful stock and the double set triggers. Even though it was a fairly expensive rifle back then, I figured perhaps it would have been a good choice for the FBI for a sniper type rifle at that time.
Looking at the photo at the gangs weapons, I'm slightly more pleased that I have my jam a matic Ortgies 32. The one in the photo however appears to be a 25 acp since mine is slightly bigger. I guess if its good enough for Dillinger, its good enough for me.
Looking at the photo at the gangs weapons, I'm slightly more pleased that I have my jam a matic Ortgies 32. The one in the photo however appears to be a 25 acp since mine is slightly bigger. I guess if its good enough for Dillinger, its good enough for me.
Big Ugly Tall Texan
New member
I have problems with that movie...
Or ANY movie that glorifies criminals.
Dillinger was a thug and nothing more.
Or ANY movie that glorifies criminals.
Dillinger was a thug and nothing more.
johnwilliamson062
Moderator
Yeah, that is why they show him being shot a half dozen times at the end of the movie with a gross wound under his right eye. Wasn't exactly a ride off into the sunset or "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid" fade to black roll credits ending.
BTW, Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid, one of my favorite movies.
Back to the real subject, ayone know of an outfit who would do that sort of work? I have a savage M12 I am working up a build for and that would be a superb feature. In the movie he first fires the rifle with only the front trigger, but from the description of function above it sounds like you must use both on every shot.
BTW, Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid, one of my favorite movies.
Back to the real subject, ayone know of an outfit who would do that sort of work? I have a savage M12 I am working up a build for and that would be a superb feature. In the movie he first fires the rifle with only the front trigger, but from the description of function above it sounds like you must use both on every shot.
Big Ugly Tall Texan
New member
Probably can't put a double-set trigger on a Savage
But a lot can be done with the trigger that comes with the rifle.
As for Dillinger, the movie definitely sought to make him more than he was. To start with, Johnny Depp looks nothing like Dillinger's ugly mugg.
It is cool they used a custom Mauser 98, however. I wonder if that is based on historic fact or was just a cutesy Hollywood idea.
But a lot can be done with the trigger that comes with the rifle.
As for Dillinger, the movie definitely sought to make him more than he was. To start with, Johnny Depp looks nothing like Dillinger's ugly mugg.
It is cool they used a custom Mauser 98, however. I wonder if that is based on historic fact or was just a cutesy Hollywood idea.
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Big Ugly Tall Texan
New member
This should answer your questions about firearms in that movie.
http://www.imfdb.org/index.php?title=Public_Enemies
http://www.imfdb.org/index.php?title=Public_Enemies
I have a double set trigger on a Thompson Center Hawken (muzzle loading) rifle and it can be used either way. You can just pull the front trigger in single stage mode and have a trigger pull like a cheap .22, or you can set the rear trigger and then the front trigger's sear releases the spring loaded rear trigger to release the sear on the hammer. This results in a trigger pull measured in ounces. You can do it either way, just like a double action revolver can be used in single action mode.
I also have another gun, a Thompson Center Patriot pistol with a double set trigger which only works in the set mode and on this gun, the front trigger is the set trigger that must be cocked and the rear trigger releases it.
LanceOregon
Moderator
As was said, it is a Winchester Model 1907 self-loading rifle. It fired a cartridge equvilent to a modern .357 magnum cartridge in ballistics, and had a 10 round detachable magazine. So it was basically a semiauto 10 shot .357 magnum rifle, which was a rather nasty gun to use in a gunfight.
It was designed by Thomas Johnson, who became Winchester's top gun designer after John Browning quit Winchester over his dispute with them over the Browning Auto-5 Johnson is better known for being the designer of the Winchester Model 12 and 21 shotguns, as well as the Model 54 Bolt Action Sporting Rifle, which was the predecessor of the Model 70.
The Mob that used the Browning BAR a lot was the Bonnie & Clyde gang. Here is a photo of Clyde with two Browning BAR's, and also a sawed off Browning Auto-5:
Sawed off Browning Auto-5 shotguns were pretty deadly close range weapons and popular among bank robbers back then. John Dillinger had a couple of them too.
There was a pretty good low budget horror movie last year called "Bonnie & Clyde Vs. Count Dracula"
Sadly, though, it completely flopped at the box office, and is not even out on video.
Here is the promo video for it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_R1RDHMGUCY&feature=player_embedded
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The notion that the movie glorified Dillinger or anything he did is laughable. Though most who would say that would say it about any movie 'about' a notorious criminal. Nor does Michael Mann do "cutesy" Hollywood foolishness. He is extremely particular about his guns and the way his actors handle them. Whether or not the Mauser or anything else in the movie was "historically accurate" is insignificant. It's a movie, for entertainment, not a documentary.
As usual, I'm late to the party but wanted to add my 2 cents about the .351 Winchester.
As far as I can determine it was quite a bit more powerful than the 357 magnum. My meager library shows the ballistics for a 351 are 180 gr at 1850-1870 fps - more like a 44 magnum or 357 Maximum with 180 gr bullet than anything else. The 357 magnum is listed as 125-158 grs at 1225 to 1450 fps.
The rifle was a serious piece of kit - nearly every motorized gang of the early-mid 1930s had one or more of these. In addition, the good guys carried and used them as well. Since their lives depended on the choice, I have to assume the rifle did the job.
And Lance, beautiful 1907!
Here's the one they duplicated from an original Dillinger gang weapon for Public Enemies:
As far as I can determine it was quite a bit more powerful than the 357 magnum. My meager library shows the ballistics for a 351 are 180 gr at 1850-1870 fps - more like a 44 magnum or 357 Maximum with 180 gr bullet than anything else. The 357 magnum is listed as 125-158 grs at 1225 to 1450 fps.
The rifle was a serious piece of kit - nearly every motorized gang of the early-mid 1930s had one or more of these. In addition, the good guys carried and used them as well. Since their lives depended on the choice, I have to assume the rifle did the job.
And Lance, beautiful 1907!
Here's the one they duplicated from an original Dillinger gang weapon for Public Enemies:
