Any recommendations for a pistol-caliber carbine?
- Thread starter Foxy
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WillBrayjr
Moderator
Maybe a used Marlin Camp 9. For $200.00 to $300.00 there's not much to choose from thats quality!
For a pistol caliber carbine your options are extremely limited in California. The only semi auto ones that are legal are the Marlin Camp 9, Marlin Camp 45, the Ruger PC9 and the Ruger PC40. I would also include the M1 Carbine, because the 30 carbine round is ballistically very similar to the .357 magnum. The Rugers and the M1 will run you around $400-$500. To meet the $200-$300 dollar requirement you will have to find a used rifle, but it will take a lot of looking. The Marlin Camp rifles are no longer in production, so finding one in that price range might be hard, but I have not really done a lot of looking for those. If your friend really wants a pistol caliber carbine in California, tell him he might want to also look at a lever action rifle. Also, the Sub 2000 is not California legal.
Springer45
New member
I agree this would be a good choice. I have a .44 mag Marlin 1894C and it's really a gas to shoot. But they don't come cheap either. One in good condition is going to run $350-375 I suspect.
RCPractitioner
New member
I have to ask: How accurate are the carbines chambered in handgun loads? I've never shot one or known anyone with one.
Check out this thread, for lots of info and links on the Marlin 1894c in .357 magnum, and also a bit about the .44mag one. Scroll down abit, untill you find the picture of a 1894. An 1894 is California-legal, don't look too scary, is up to three times more powerfull than other pistol-caliber carbines (1894c in .357mag, energy at the muzzle), and you can also shoot .38spl's in it.
No, I don't work for Marlin(don't even live on the same continent), but I got this particular rifle myself, and love it.
No, I don't work for Marlin(don't even live on the same continent), but I got this particular rifle myself, and love it.
WillBrayjr
Moderator
The Ruger 96/44 my grandfather traded in on for a 77/44 would put rounds through the same hole all day at 50yards
smalltownguy
New member
ruger pc9 or pc40 IIRC CDNN had them (pc40) for $299 cheap mags for both, it is like a 10-22 on steroids....
marlin camp 9
I got a marlin camp 9. I bought it new and have a maximum of 200 rounds through it. I am a meticulous gun cleaner and preserver. Wood and metal all like new. I didnt know people were looking for these I like the interchangeability of the mags with my 9mm smith and wesson 3rd gen.
I wanted to offer it for sale but, now that I think about it, I think Ill keep it. Its great but for the really heavy trigger, the primative iron sights, and weak recoil spring.
I got a marlin camp 9. I bought it new and have a maximum of 200 rounds through it. I am a meticulous gun cleaner and preserver. Wood and metal all like new. I didnt know people were looking for these I like the interchangeability of the mags with my 9mm smith and wesson 3rd gen.
I wanted to offer it for sale but, now that I think about it, I think Ill keep it. Its great but for the really heavy trigger, the primative iron sights, and weak recoil spring.
Dave Markowitz
New member
It's easy to fix 2 of these problems.
First, replace the wimpy factory recoil spring with a 16# spring from Wolff. Next, replace the rear sight with a Williams Guideline rear peep, or mount a red dot.
The trigger can be improved but I understand that taking apart the trigger group on a Camp Carbine is not for the faint of heart. More specifically, getting it back together is a b**ch.
I have a Camp 45 and it's a really fun, reliable, and accurate gun with the stronger recoil spring and red dot.
Unlike the 94, the Winchester 1892 or "92" as most call it, had an action that was designed for the pistol-length and powered cartridges from the start and is quite strong--can basically take any load you can throw at it, including hot .44 Mags. Winchester (basically Browning of Japan) recently made a limited run of 92 short rifles in a few different popular calibers, and a .45 Colt Trapper. However, these are not cheap and employ a tang safety behind the hammer. Among more affordable guns, used Rossi 92s (some are inexplicably also called 65s) -- replicas of the Winchester 1892 carbine, with 20" barrel--are easy to find in your price range. These are pretty well made - especially for the price - and reliable shooters. Some CAS (cowboy action shooters) types slick these 92 actions up fairly easily as well. Available fairly widely in .45 Colt (Long Colt not ACP), .44 Mag/44 Sp. and .357/.38 (of the most popular calibers) and 10 round capacity (having nothing to do with the "ban" era...always had 10, maybe 11 with the non-magnum counterpart calibers of .44 and .38 Sp.?). Current distributors of new versions (mid $300s) are EMF and Navy Arms of the non-safety variety, and LSI (Legacy Sports International) with a small receiver-top safety lever, as well as more expensive (along the lines at least of the new Winchesters) Italian 92 replicas by Armi Sport, imported by Taylor's and now Cimarron. The latter company I believe does not (yet) have the carbine variant. Somewhere priced between the Rossi-made 92s and the Winchester and Armi's you will find Browning (original designer) 92 carbines made in the late 70s in Japan (same factory I believe as the current run). These are real gems in .44 Mag and .357 Mag, but increasingly rare. LSI (Rossi with safety) also has a 454 Casul version in the $375-400 range, new. The older Rossi (label) version was also available in a 16" "Trapper" carbine version in some calibers, with slightly reduced cartridge capacity of course.
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Tpaw, I agree. I don't particularly care for the limited capacity and rotary design of the mag - Ruger why no stick mag at least of 10 shot cap? And I wish it were a hair lighter for the format and the stock was a bit more streamlined like an M-1 carbine in the forward hand position --mine was a bit squared off (I suppose could be re-shaped?)...but otherwise, a great gun. This subject brings up fact that Ruger does have a similar .44 Mag gun in a lever design--worthy of consideration.
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This may not be the direction you want to go, but I recently bought a Rossi single shot in 45Colt. It's light, accurate, fun to shoot. They have made them in 357 and 44mag., but I think they are discontinuing them. Hopefully even the liberals in Calif. won't ban a single shot! Oh, and the price, new, was $175.
CarbineCaleb
New member
CA Carbine
You didn't specify what this person wanted it for - for deer hunting, a .357magnum, .44magnum, or 30-30 levergun will do the trick, and can be found cheaply used. Especially the 30-30, piles of these out there.
For home defense, I really like the Ruger PC9GR or PC4GR - the GR models have much nicer sights. These are short 9mm and .40S&W semiauto carbines that are solidly built, with very nice open sights for quick acquisition, and can manage a higher rate of fire, with less motion required than a levergun.
You didn't specify what this person wanted it for - for deer hunting, a .357magnum, .44magnum, or 30-30 levergun will do the trick, and can be found cheaply used. Especially the 30-30, piles of these out there.
For home defense, I really like the Ruger PC9GR or PC4GR - the GR models have much nicer sights. These are short 9mm and .40S&W semiauto carbines that are solidly built, with very nice open sights for quick acquisition, and can manage a higher rate of fire, with less motion required than a levergun.
bubbygator
New member
I recently bought a Stainless Steel LSI Puma 92 in .38/.357. It is a solid, reliable shooter. I'm in the process of improving the sights to accomodate my bad eyes - using a Williams Fire Sight on the front and a drop-in replacement Williams Peep sight for the rear..... but it shot pretty good just as it came. I paid $450 NIB, but there are used, blued models of Rossi, EMF, & ?? out there for less.
Yes, used Rossi's (also makers of the LSI) can be found in the $200-225-250 territory, esp ones of actual "Rossi" stamped name (vs the slightly nicer finished EMF and Navy Arms Rossis). I do not believe Navy Arms sells the blue'd models any more, but used to. These older Rossis are/were available in .357/.38, .44 Mag/.44 Sp, .45 LC, and the "old west" round .44-40 (.44 WCF), as well as more recent LSI offerings of the .454 Casul and maybe.480 Ruger (someone correct me on the last one). Of the newer "Rossis," only EMF and LSI offer the .44 Mag. All of the "under .454 range" shoot about point of aim at 100 yds and start dropping off past that *(certainly past 125, maybe 135-150 with the right .44 Mag and .357 load, you're "lobbing" rounds!), but you don't want one of these for long range shooting anyway---so within their limits, practical, accurate, reliable and fun to shoot (and the 20" barrel, again, does wonders for a pistol round, ballistically speaking!).
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The power levels of any pistol cartridge are going to be higher in a carbine than in a pistol simply because of the increased burn time.
What is your friend looking to accomplish with this carbine? Are high-capacity mags (10+ rounds) available for it? You really do want at least 13 rounds in that carbine....just for the heck of it.
Are parts available? Can it be tricked out?
FWIW, I have a marlin m45 camp carbine and thoroughly enjoy it. They are very accurate, though I wish there was more I could do with it in terms of trickery. I'll be putting a Choate folder on it, and a Williams rear sight, but that seems to be the end of the mods available.
Spare parts are available, and you want to be sure to have a spare hammer strut and hammer strut bridge as these are the weak links in the system, even with a stronger recoil spring.
I'm also looking into the Keltec carbines, hoping they can run with CZ 75 magazines.
What is your friend looking to accomplish with this carbine? Are high-capacity mags (10+ rounds) available for it? You really do want at least 13 rounds in that carbine....just for the heck of it.
Are parts available? Can it be tricked out?
FWIW, I have a marlin m45 camp carbine and thoroughly enjoy it. They are very accurate, though I wish there was more I could do with it in terms of trickery. I'll be putting a Choate folder on it, and a Williams rear sight, but that seems to be the end of the mods available.
Spare parts are available, and you want to be sure to have a spare hammer strut and hammer strut bridge as these are the weak links in the system, even with a stronger recoil spring.
I'm also looking into the Keltec carbines, hoping they can run with CZ 75 magazines.