Im kicking around the idea of buying a Sar b6p 9mm 4.5" barrel or a EAA ea9 Witness both identical CZ75b clones. Strictly for plinking or a range gun as I have other self defense guns. The Sar I found is going for 298$ + shiping & trans. Ive owned a Tristar 120 and till today a Canick tp9sa both worked and felt like they were worth more than their price . Both were hi quality never a hiccup with a few thousand rds thru each. Although the Canick had the edge in fit n finish imo. My question is do the Canick, Tristar and Sars come out of the same Turkish factory. And ....given a Sar b6p or a EAA ea witness 9mm wich do you beleive is the better qaulity of the two. Lastly where is the EAA WITNESS made it looks very similar to all the guns mentioned.
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Any cz clone experts out there..
- Thread starter Sterling
- Start date
Not an expert but I do believe the Canik and TriStars come from the same factory. The Sarsilmaz is a different company. I also own a TriStar T-120. Love it. I have a Witness full size steel in 10mm and it is pretty nice quality wise. My SAR B6PC is really nice too. I know it's apples to oranges but I think the SAR is put together just a little bit better than the Witness.
Walt Sherrill
New member
Just a informational note: almost none of the guns called CZ clones are clones -- they are gun based on the same basic design. These guns are more-correctly called "CZ Pattern" guns.
About the only parts that are interchangeable are magazines (in most cases) and recoil springs -- but that's not a guarantee. Almost nothing else is truly interchangeable -- one of the characteristics of a true clone. Slides won't interchange, dovetails (for after-market sights) are different, pins are different (in diameter and length, and whether they're solid or roll pins), even how the firing pin block works can be different. Springs are often different.
I've owned the Italian-made Tanfoglio and Witness guns, and the Swiss-made ITM and Sphinx CZ alternatives. I have shot the Israeli-made David, Baby Eagle, etc. All of them are good guns, but the Swiss Sphinx guns may be the best of the bunch (and typically a good bit more expensive, new or used.)
The Turkish-made variants appear to be pretty good, too, based on feedback on forums like this, but I have no personal experience with them.
About the only parts that are interchangeable are magazines (in most cases) and recoil springs -- but that's not a guarantee. Almost nothing else is truly interchangeable -- one of the characteristics of a true clone. Slides won't interchange, dovetails (for after-market sights) are different, pins are different (in diameter and length, and whether they're solid or roll pins), even how the firing pin block works can be different. Springs are often different.
I've owned the Italian-made Tanfoglio and Witness guns, and the Swiss-made ITM and Sphinx CZ alternatives. I have shot the Israeli-made David, Baby Eagle, etc. All of them are good guns, but the Swiss Sphinx guns may be the best of the bunch (and typically a good bit more expensive, new or used.)
The Turkish-made variants appear to be pretty good, too, based on feedback on forums like this, but I have no personal experience with them.
StumpShooter
New member
I've had the CZ, Witness, and B6Pc. All are great but the B6P is really the best "value" and shoots great.
I love my Italian Tanfoglio Witness and have heard lots of good things about the Turkish clones. It's probably win/win.
Yup. I was about to say the same.
rt11002003
New member
I have a Sphinx compact and a Witness Tanfoglio Elite Limited. As Walt Sherill says they might look like CZ's, but they're not Clones. My Limited was more expensive than the Sphinx.
They're both great guns. I use the Limited more because I can mount a red dot. I feel the Sphinx might be slightly better quality.
They're both great guns. I use the Limited more because I can mount a red dot. I feel the Sphinx might be slightly better quality.
I have the now discontinued SAR B6 (the metal one, not the P for plastic) which is a quality piece that shoots great, the only off bit being the backwards safety. This is my standard range plinking and warmup gun, which lives more or less permanently in my range bag.
A week after I bought mine for $299 I saw a vendor at a gun show trying to sell them for $550.
A week after I bought mine for $299 I saw a vendor at a gun show trying to sell them for $550.
The Turkish-made variants appear to be pretty good, too, based on feedback on forums like this, but I have no personal experience with them.
I have. Five different Turkish guns and everyone of them was POS. Took me a while, but I learned my lesson about Turkish guns.
One Canik CZ clone, one Regent, one MKE .380 and two Sarsilmaz shotguns.
triplebike
New member
Check out the Sarsilmaz B6P or the ST10. They are both simply fantastic handguns & one of the best values available. I own both, my B6P has over 2000 flawless rds through it & I purchased it used for $200. They're going for around $300 new. My ST10 has over 1000 flawless rds through it & I purchased it new for $359.
Do your research on Sarsilmaz & you'll find that they are as state of the art in handgun manufacturing as you can get. Family owned , producing firearms over 130 years.
Other than GYVEL , who just seems to have a hardon for Turkish made handguns, you'll find nothing but glowing reviews for these handguns.
Do your research on Sarsilmaz & you'll find that they are as state of the art in handgun manufacturing as you can get. Family owned , producing firearms over 130 years.
Other than GYVEL , who just seems to have a hardon for Turkish made handguns, you'll find nothing but glowing reviews for these handguns.
I've got a Canik T120 and love it. I just put a fiber-optic sight on it a couple days ago and I'm excited to try it with the new sights.
My impression is that the tanfo/witness line fits larger hands better (like mine) and the SAR is better for small hands. Canik and CZ in the middle. Those who know more might differ with me on that. All great guns.
My impression is that the tanfo/witness line fits larger hands better (like mine) and the SAR is better for small hands. Canik and CZ in the middle. Those who know more might differ with me on that. All great guns.
SlvrDragon50
New member
You can post your question over on czfirearms.us if you want additional help.
I did a ton of research when looking for my first gun (ended up getting a CZ 85C), but the SAR is going to be the best for the money by far.
The EAA is going to be better quality, but are you really going to get like 150-200 more worth? Probably not.
I did a ton of research when looking for my first gun (ended up getting a CZ 85C), but the SAR is going to be the best for the money by far.
The EAA is going to be better quality, but are you really going to get like 150-200 more worth? Probably not.
Put a order for a sar today.
At 266$ new. I ordered a SAR b6p 9mm 4.5" barrel ,the steel frame variant would have been my first choice but those are unicorns. Anyhow I felt one up not long ago and it fit very well in my hand sights seemed typical 3dot. Since it comes with one mag I ordered a extra. Overall feedback has been 90% positive on these guns. Something I noticed these last couple of weeks is theres hardly anymore modern hammer fired pistols seems like they have all gone the striker fired way and thats fine too. Ill post a range report in a week or so on my dedicated plinker.
At 266$ new. I ordered a SAR b6p 9mm 4.5" barrel ,the steel frame variant would have been my first choice but those are unicorns. Anyhow I felt one up not long ago and it fit very well in my hand sights seemed typical 3dot. Since it comes with one mag I ordered a extra. Overall feedback has been 90% positive on these guns. Something I noticed these last couple of weeks is theres hardly anymore modern hammer fired pistols seems like they have all gone the striker fired way and thats fine too. Ill post a range report in a week or so on my dedicated plinker.
Other than GYVEL , who just seems to have a hardon for Turkish made handguns,
You bet I have a hard on. Wouldn't you after getting five POS in a row?
Walt Sherrill
New member
Other than GYVEL , who just seems to have a hardon for Turkish made handguns,Gyvel said:You bet I have a hard on. Wouldn't you after getting five POS in a row?
For some shooters, it only takes ONE bad experience to call foul on the gun or type. You're more lenient than some...
Walt Sherrill
New member
Sterling said:Something I noticed these last couple of weeks is theres hardly anymore modern hammer fired pistols seems like they have all gone the striker fired way and thats fine too. Ill post a range report in a week or so on my dedicated plinker.
It's true that striker-fired is the new normal, but CZ (all the 75Bs, and the newer P-07/P-09) Tanfoglio/Witness, Sphinx, FN (FNX), Beretta, SIG (more models than I care to list, including the new P-225), and a few others are still putting out hammer-fired guns.
triplebike
New member
Seems GYVEL makes it a point to post in every thread that concerns Turkish firearms to tell us all that they're such POS. He's probably the only person on the planet that has purchased five " pos" turkish handguns in a row. I say it's bullcrap. He's got a better chance of hitting the lottery.
Walt Sherrill
New member
As I wrote earlier, with some folks it only takes ONE bad experience -- and sometimes the folks having that bad experience don't even bother to contact the gunmaker or importer -- they just trade them or sell them (often at a loss.)
Just mention CZs and see what you hear from at least one forum member...
Five in a row is a big string of bad luck. I'd be more concerned if I knew that all five came from the same company.
It might be useful if Gyvel shared more details about his experiences.
Just mention CZs and see what you hear from at least one forum member...
Five in a row is a big string of bad luck. I'd be more concerned if I knew that all five came from the same company.
It might be useful if Gyvel shared more details about his experiences.