ALERT!!!ALERT!!!! ALERT !!! DANGER!! LOSS OF RIGHTS!!!!!

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ernest2

New member
http://www.thefiringline.com:8080/forums/showthread.php?threadid=27209

This is the ignored thread due to poor labeling on the part of the original poster
that explains the topic more fully.

The firearms community can not afford to ignore this because of poor labeling; so I am forced to repost using stronger attention getting terms.

Clinton used executive orders to ban the import of foriegn made semi auto rifles and pistols in 1997 and Bush senior used executive orders to ban assault rifles in 1988.

NOW , CLINTON PLANS TO USE EXECUTIVE ORDERS TO FORCE FEDERAL FIREARMS REGISTRATION
AND GUN OWNER LICENSING.

So what, says asleep on guard duty Joe 6 pack
average gun owner.

SO THIS,....... YELLS ERNEST 2 JUST AS VERY LOUDLY AS HE POSSIBLY CAN.

What this means is .........how would you like to pay $50.oo per year, per gun to the federal government each and every year for each and every gun you own?????

And just what, I ask, makes you think that the registration fee will remain at only $50.oo per gun per year.

The fee can easly be increased to 150.oo per gun per year or more....whenever the govt feels like it.

I own 120 guns times $50.oo = only a measely
$6,000.oo per year to register my gun collection.

At 150.oo per gun per year, it would only cost me $18,000.oo per year to federally register my gun collection.

No problem,
I should have that in my back pocket.

yea! Sure! right.

Not in my wildest dreams could I come up with that kind of extra cash on my best month!

BUT WAIT, THERE IS MORE!!! I forgot to mention the $100.oo per year fee and
Federal Licensing Test for Licensed gun owners.

DO I HAVE YOUR ATTENTION YET???????

Please,please,and pretty please with hot choclate fudge and vanilla ice cream on it,

GO TO

http://www.executiveorders.org/


and find the congressional letter sender and send email and telephone calls and US postal mail to your congressmen and representatives
asking them to support


Senate Bill S1795
and House Bill HB2655


These are bills already introduced in Congress to stop Clinton from stealing
our Second Ammendment Rights and Freedoms
by one man "KING'S COMMANDMENTS" Executive
Orders.


Clinton is clearly misusing the power of executive orders to create new laws ,without
lawfull Congressional legislation.


WE CAN NOT AFFORD TO LET HIM GET AWAY WITH THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Executive orders are susposed to be used by the president to enforce laws already made by Congress but never to create new laws
without the approval of Congress, without
due legislative process or public debate by the elected representatives of the people.

------------------
GUN CONTROL puts THE CONTROL
in the hands of THE CRIMINALS.


-----------------------------------------------
In 2000, we must become politically active in
support of gun rights or we WILL LOSE the right
& the freedom.
-------------------------
NO FATE BUT WHAT WE MAKE!!!
----------------------
Every year,over 2 million Americans use firearms
not to take live but to preserve life,....limb & family
.Gun Control Democrats would prefer that they are all disarmed
and helpless and die victims of felony violence,instead.

Protect your gun rights, go to:
http://www.trteam.com/
The Tyrany Response Team
 
E

ernest2

New member
Dear Gorthaur,

Please explain to me why you are discounting this ,in my opinion, serioius threat. I realise that it was a prediction
however, I see nothing to stop Clinton from doing it, except that Clinton will wait until after the election so that the Demoncraps can get the maximum political milage out of the gun control debate.

Once the election is decieded, please explain to me ,just one little thing, if you would be so kind ,that might stop Clintin from doing this.

Clinton has used executive orders to impliment gun contol in 1994 with the Chineese made firearms ban and again in 1997 with the foriegn made semi auto rifle and pistol ban and George Bush SR used executive orders for thw1988 assault rifle ban.

So, whats to stop Clinton, from yet again,
using executive orders???????

Pleas ---somebody---clue me in!!!!
 
E

ernest2

New member
Gorthaur, You have a great web page!
I like it!
Nice first step on a gun collection, too!
All high quality firearms, no junk in your safe!
Actually,judging by the quality, you probably
already traided in your lesser firearms
for what you really wanted.
I, on the other hand,keep every thing and just tend to buy more!

I tried to email you ,but it did not go though. Did you change your email address?

gorthaur@dosbears.com does not seem to work.
Give me a yell!
eernest2@yahoo.com
 
S

scud

New member
It wouldn't surprise me Ernest. These scumbags will do anything legal or not to push their agenda forward. We're one shooting & following exec. order ( for the children of course) away from this: Today President Clinton / Gore has said enough is enough, there will be a end to the violence, I am decreeing a state of national emergency and immediately outlawing all firearms. These common sense measures are absoultely necessary if we are to live in a free society where children can play in the streets without the fear of being gunned down in the midst of this raging epidemic. And kids , be sure to turn in your parents !

Well the last part probably won't be publicaly stated it will just be common sense cirruculum.

Yea it's pessimistic. By no means am I advocating complacancy, I'm just disillusioned with our allegedly democratic process. Take it as a rant.

i cannut spull vary wull.


[This message has been edited by scud (edited June 05, 2000).]
 
E

ernest2

New member
Yes. I did hear that Clinton was going to declare Marshal Law so that he can stay in
office.

My response was to buy two more cases of ammo and hope that I can use them only for just target shooting at the range!

Actually, I find it hard to believe that even a (insert swear word of your choice) like Clinton, would go that far.

I find it far more reasonable to believe that Clinton would try the executive order
as a parting bite on the ass to the NRA and the second ammendment.
 
H

HARDBALL

New member
Having lived in Los Angeles for sixteen years,I believe I have a pretty good idea what the Government has planned for the rest of the Country. Total Confiscation! California is THE model for the entire U.S.
As far as Martial Law and Clinton,even though many people here and else where my scoff at that notion,let me just say this...
I caught only a couple of minutes of the Clinton fund raiser/dinner (shown on C-Span)
a few weeks ago (where Clinton was doing his stand up routine) Within about one minute of speaking,Clinton made TWO references about remaining in power! I have also heard from a reporter on C-Span the in a private conversation with Clinton,that one of his favorite movies is "THE MAN WHO WOULD BE KING"! (by the way,a terrific film) however,Clinton must surely like it for other reasons.
Question... Is there anything in the "Books"/laws, that would enable a standing President to remain in power?
I would put NOTHING past Clinton to remain in power. I fear some kind of "MAJOR" and I mean Major event around the time of the election. I pray to God,I hope I wrong!
I did live under Martial Law durning the L.A. riots,...sooooooo glad I now live in Maine,which is about as far away as I could get.
 
U

USP45usp

Moderator
I will now make my Predictions (consulting the magic bullet): Before the election, or during if Bush is winning, a major National Security threat, i.e. a terroist(sp) attack involving either nukes or bio, will happen. Since klinton wants to give free rein to the CIA, FBI and the Military, these departments will be used to "counter-attack" but martial law will first have to be imposed. All gun-owners will have to give the government thier guns, to help ensure the government has enough firepower to combat these attacks. All SUV's will have to be given to the government as transport vehicles, all water reserves, gas (oil) reserves, food and housing will have to be taken to provide enough assets to combat these attacks. All American people will be given tasks by the government to help ensure victory. All ages will need to contribute something to this cause: Babies will be used to develope Bio toxins (used baby diapers), young children will finger paint propaganda posters, young adults will work in the factories, while older adults will be issued bull horns (not weapons) to taunt the enemy and become living targets to draw out the BG's into the open. We will live in government barracks (and if your ex-military, you know what "great" places these are), be issued rice and bread to eat, and live in a compound, protected by wire and guards, for your own safety. I'm being sarcastic, but it could become real.

USP45usp
 
D

Dead

New member
:mad:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Clinton used executive orders to ban the import of foriegn made semi auto rifles and pistols in 1997 and Bush senior used executive orders to ban assault rifles in 1988[/quote]

Umm Cliton was in '94, Bush was in '89.
Regan banned the Legal manufacter of Transferable Full Auto's in '86.
'34, and '68 - Horrid years ugh!! I could go on and on!!

Those were sad sad years for the 2nd. makes me wanna cry!


------------------
-AoW[t]-Dead [Black Ops]
 
D

Dead

New member
OH AND IF YOU THINK THAT IS BAD LOOK AT THIS.. This is an tidbit from gunowners.org. Amazing what "The Government" wants to do.. This shows how little they believe that the Bill of Rights even exsists!!! 4th Amendment, whats that?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Oppose Legislation Giving Clinton The Power To Conduct Secret Searches On Your Property


Like a weed spreading through your garden, a provision proposing to give the Justice Department frightening new powers keeps popping up in bill after bill. Specifically, this "sneak and peek" provision would let the government sneak onto your property while you were away, seize certain items from your home and not tell you about it for months -- if at all.


Currently, the provisions are in two bills (the bankruptcy and methamphetamine bills), but if the provision becomes law, it would apply to all federal agents and all searches and seizures -- not just those affecting bankruptcy and drug cases.[/quote]

------------------
-AoW[t]-Dead [Black Ops]
 
J

Jeff Thomas

New member
Sorry, but I'm with Gorthaur. Let's focus on clear and present dangers, not potential problems.

I agree the Executive Order trend must be reversed. But, going on and on about what might happen because no one will stop Clinton simply makes RKBA supporters look a bit overboard, IMHO.

Let's ignore the black helicopters, and stay focused on retaining the Bill of Rights.

Regards from AZ
 
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ernest2

New member
ok ,I have been waiting patiently for some
body,any body, for about two days now,
to please explain to me why tfl people get all excited about something like the mmm
but discount the threat of executive orders.

Why do you think this is not important.
Why do you think that it is not a real threat.

I am not trying to be sarcastic or a wise guy or a troll, I am asking an honest question here and I would appreciate a serious answer.

Sorry, but there are gaps in my public school education so if I cant figure something out, I am going to keep asking questions until some one answers me.

Congress seems to think it is important enough to have two bills one in the house,
hb2256 and S1795 in the senate.

So why aren't you guys yacking this up and
telling everyone to visit www.executiveorders.org/

Gorthaur, im a reply to me above, implied that this was not a serious threat and yet in a seperate post advocates others to visit www.executiveorders.org/ and send letters, email amd phone your congressmen and representatives.

So now I am confused. Is Gorthaur playing with me? I me , thats ok by me , but let me in on whats going on!
You know, I cant see his smile on my computer screen, so this could lead to confusion.
Or did Gorthaur change his mind after visiting www.executiveorders.org/
Again ,I dont mind, but I hate being confused
almost as much as I would hate being a disarmed sheeple, which I used to be prior to 1983.
I didn't mind it( being a disarmed victim back in 83) then because I never realized how dangerious it was to be a disarmed victim and have to depend on " Dial 911
and die," for my protection.

Now, that would seem the heart of stupidity and needless, foolish risk taking to me and I would never willingly go back to being that way again.

ANY HOW-PLEASE EXPLAIN WHY PREVENTING CLINTON
FROM MISUSING EXECUTIVE ORDERS TO ILLEGALLY
MAKE LEGISLATION (making legislation is NOT CLINTON'S JOB, but rather a power Constitutionally granted to both houses of Congress)WITHOUT DUE PROSESS OF REPRESESENTATIVE LEGISLATION is not athreat to be taken seriously.

I mean, if Clinton used executive orders to ban the import of foriegn made semi auto
rifles & pistols in 1997 and all Chinese
made firearms and ammo in 1994 and Bush Senior used executive orders to ban assault rifles in 1988 ---what is not serious about this ??? Why should we just forget about it
and not worry.

I REALLY DONT UNDERSTAND AND WOULD LIKE AN SERIOUS ANSWER.

It is obvious that the NRA is not concerned about this, or does NOT WISH to give the appearence of being either concerned or aware of this because I have not heard one peep from NRA on this subject.

The peep may have been peeped, but I didn't catch it.

So I would like to understand why I was told to worry about a serious threat, inplying that this threat is not serious.

Funny, it looks like a serious threat; it seems to me that Clinton could just executive
order federal registration of all guns and federal licensing of all gun owners and then executive order confiscation of all federally registered guns from all federally licensed gun owners, just about when ever the whim pleases him.

I think I must have missed something.

I am told that this is not a serious concern.

But, no one tells me why this is not a serious concern, and I would really
like to know.
I realize that I am not a very sharp knife
and that other knifes in the drawer are more sharp that I am , so whould those sharper
knifes please tell this dull knife why I should not be worried about executive orders?

Worried and inquiring minds want to know.
 
E

ernest2

New member
Reply to Dead
Dear Dead,You are correct about Clinton's executive order banning all Chinese
firearms and ammo in 1994 and you are correct about George Bush Senior's executive order ban of all foriegn made assault rifles
with pistol grips and folding stocks, bayonet lugs and flash suppressers in 1989.

I thought that it was 1988 because I remember the media circus in 1988 about it.
But , the executive order did not take effect until 1989, so you are correct and I stand corrected.

However, Dead, you seem to have forgotten about Clinton's executive order ban of european foriegn made semi auto rifles with thumbhole grips, called "assault rifle clones " by the media anti civil rights gun grabbers and this ban also included some russian,bulgarian,check,romanian, east german, spainish and other european made semi auto pistols. Not all european semi auto pistols, but about 60% of them.

This ban is why it is so expensive and hard to find a SLR 95 rifle, a SLR96 rifle,
and some others that I cant recall (sas93,sas94) or something similar.

That particular bann was circumvented by the 922 loophole in the U.S. Gun Control Act of 1968 , copied from the Gun Control Act of Nazi Germany 1938, which counts a foriegn made semi auto rifle , called "assault rifle" by some, as an American made rifle if 7 or more usa parts are installed on it.

And that bann did not effect so called
"assault rifles" make to accept only 10 shot magazines.
Of course, with only 10 shots,
most people would not buy the gun except as a Lame Last Resort because it is too much like having a V8 Cadalac with a 1 PINT GASOLINE TANK, as soon as you start the engine ,it is empty and this can get you stranded in the middle of bad territory.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
REPLY TO JEFF THOMAS

Dear Jeff,
What I am woried about IS what I consider a clear and present and prehaps imminent danger.

In my reply to Dead, above , I have listed the three times in the past that EXECUTIVE ORDERS have been used, twice now by Clinton and once by George Bush Senior
to illegally and unconstitutionally strip law
abiding Americans of their Constitutionally Guaranteed Civil Rights.

Dear Jeff, I would consider it a favor if you could convince me that I am mistaken about this, so that I could stop worrying about this, and prehaps try to enjoy my life again.

I am afraid of ignoring that big black helicopter hoovering over my roof, because if
its engine stops, it will flatten my house!

But maybe I worry for nothing, prehaps it will fly away before it runs out of gas.

But I think I'd like to get out from directly underneath it, all the same!!

[This message has been edited by ernest2 (edited June 07, 2000).]
 
L

Leadfoot

New member
Sure, Klinton could do it. Will he? I doubt it. He knows if he goes for the whole enchilada at once the balloon goes up.

He prefers to nibble away while keeping his approval ratings up.

This is becoming an Internet Legend. It started as one person's "What if".
 
G

Gorthaur

New member
Ernest, executive orders have been an issue since, literally, George Washington's administration. There has always been ambiguity about the powers of the president. I do support, especially, H.R. 2655. I have some minor quibbles with S. 1795. Primarily <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Require a cost-benefit analysis and a public comment period before an executive order can take effect.[/quote]As long as the other restrictions are followed, the main reason for allowing any executive orders is that the President can act quickly, without a "comment period."

Now, as to the specifics of the post, this is clearly "crying wolf." Clinton has not issued this order, nor promised to, nor hinted that he will. If he did, no one would enforce such a ludicrous lame-duck order. There would be some legal nicety, such as an injunction granted by the Supreme Court (which is still, after all, under the control of a pro-RKBA Chief Justice). It just isn't going to happen.

You might want to take a look at the other forums - glocktalk, ar15 - most everybody feels that the original post is a bit far-fetched.

------------------
Support the US Olympic Shooting Team!
Protect your Right to Keep and Bear Arms!
 
E

ernest2

New member
Thank You Leadfoot!
That makes a lot of sense to me!

I feel you are right that Clinton wants to do this piece meal, a slice at the time,
so as not to p!ss off too many people all
at once and "PREHAPS" cause needless bloodshed.

Or is that NEEDFULL BLOODSHED.

The quote that sticks in my mind here is:

"The tree of liberty requires occasional watering by the blood of both tyrants and patriots alike."

Now I understand better what is meant when they say Liberty is not Free.

Also, I was not aware that this "issue"
started someplace else on the net as one
person's so called "What if".

Can you comfirm that?


My first knowledge of this was an email Alert that I recieved from a reputable source
and upon comming here to TFL if found what I
took for valid comformation in the previous thread that I provided a link to at the begining of this thread.

I was aware that in "the linked to thread "
at the top of this thread, the original poster made " a prediction" but as the historical precidents of this abuse of power were all in place and backed up by enough totally proper concern that bills are pending sponsorship in both the
US House of Reps and the US Senate, that there is cause here for Significant Legitimete Concern.

However,after some late arriving but greatly welcomed meaningfull explinations it seems proper that the immediate
urgency of a Condition Red Alert is not called for at this time, and so I am downgrading the alert to Condition Yellow.

This means that we do not expect and executive orders to be forthcomming until
at least November, at which time I recommend carefull watchfullness of Clinton and hightened awareness of what he is up to.

Clinton may do nothing with executive orders in Nov 2000, but he could,the consensus , that I just became aware of 4:20am june 7,2000 is that Clinton will not.

However, this is only the consensus of
concerned speculators, so we need to maintain hightened awareness of this issue
and we need to get some safe guards in place before ExecutiveOrders are yet again used against us , as I guarantee you that they will be at some time.

To all my readers , Thank You
for your kind consideration and attention. I am much relieved to find out that we have yet some time to respond to
this problem.
It is not nor was it ever my intention to call wolf or try to get anyone worked up needlessly.

However, I am still very glad that we had these discusions and hightened the awareness of our readers, as well as our own awareness.

I still recommend to all who have not yet done so, go to http://www.executiveorders.org

Its just that now I no longer need to get myself all worked up and worried over this. I still support it and will keep an eye on it and I urge all who read this to do so, also.
 
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