A.S.M. 1847 walker

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mudduckie

New member
Hey all, new here but, I've searched and searched and cannot find another one.
I bought a Walker from an estate auction a few years ago. Unfortunately collector passed away family knew nothing of his collection and just wanted the $$$.
Anyways, this piece is new never fired. First character of serial is "B". It has a ASM makers mark but has no proof marks at all from Italy. No date code either. It does have the A.S.M. 44 cal black powder only made in Italy under barrel.
I have seen ASM made some in the 1890's but they had colt barrels correct? I know Italy didn't start proof marks until 1923 so does this mean my walker is over 100 years old? Seems there would be a reason why this was one of the very few out of 240 guns he never shot. Looking for age/value if its at all possible.
 
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Hellgate

New member
It may be a Walker made from a kit and not proofed. I doubt ASM was making reproductions much before the 1960s. I don't believe any original percussion revolvers ever wrote "Black Powder Only" on their barrels because black was the only powder out there. I owned an ASM Walker about 25 years ago but the cylinder started rubbing on the frame so I considered it poorly made, sold it, and bought a pair of Ubertis and never looked back. Yours may fetch a couple hundred bucks or more but it is no antique.
 
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Aguila Blanca

Staff
https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php?/topic/234175-what-ever-happen-to-army-san-marcos-guns/

ASM was one of the first Italian manufacturers back in 1960 along with Uberti. Replica Arms was the first importer for ASM revolvers, the first being the 1847 Walker. I do remember an article about this first revolver in that it was so exactly copied from an original that even experienced Colt collectors had difficulty in telling the prototype from an original. Changes were made in the production guns to make sure they could not be passed off as an original. Also, ASM use forged frames instead of castings on many of their revolvers.

Replica Arms of El Paso, TX was started by L.F. Allen. This was sold and moved to Marietta, OH., and then, in around 1973, was sold to Navy Arms. Allen then started Western Arms which became Allen Arms, and then to Cimarron.

I remember that ASM was sold to American Western Arms who only produces cartridge revolvers. ASM attempted to revive its percussion revolvers with limited success and finally closed its doors several years back.
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Also: https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=477955
 
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Hawg

New member
Yeah, it was probably a kit gun from the 1970's or 80's. The Colt marked barrels were for Colt 2nd gens. Uberti supplied the parts for them and subcontracted Colt marked barrels from ASM. ASM got stuck with a lot of them when Colt ceased production in 1982 and used them on their own guns. No ASM is 100 years old.
 
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44 AMP

Staff
The ASM that I am familiar with is Armi San Markos.

I would not recommend them to anyone.

I have no personal experience with their cap & ball stuff but do have some with their cartridge firearms and its like this...

They look great!! They work like crap, if they work, at all.

I would consider anything from Armi San Markos to be a wall hanger decoration, at best.

That just my personal opinion, based on my limited personal experience. I hope you have a decent gun there, but I don't expect anything good.

It's NOT a hundred + years old, it might be a kit built gun from the 1950s or newer. Armi San Marcos was considered the bottom tier quality Italian imports. Nicely finished, but poorly built.
 
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Hawg

New member
44 AMP said:
Armi San Marcos was considered the bottom tier quality Italian imports. Nicely finished, but poorly built.
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Actually the early ASM's were pretty good. It was the last few years quality control went to crap. The bottom of the barrel Italian guns have to be PR or Palmetto with Palmetto being a shade better.
 
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Tejicano

New member
If you do plan to shoot it be sure to check the actual bore of the cylinder and the barrel. A lot of the early Italian imports had bores that measured at 0.440 and worked best with a 0.445 ball. I had three different replicas from the mid-1970's which were this way.

The actual period Colt revolvers used a much larger ball and sometime in the 1990's (or so - I've heard different stories) the Italians started making replicas which had the larger, correct bore diameters.
 
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Hawg

New member
Tejicano said:
If you do plan to shoot it be sure to check the actual bore of the cylinder and the barrel. A lot of the early Italian imports had bores that measured at 0.440 and worked best with a 0.445 ball. I had three different replicas from the mid-1970's which were this way.

The actual period Colt revolvers used a much larger ball and sometime in the 1990's (or so - I've heard different stories) the Italians started making replicas which had the larger, correct bore diameters.
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I've never heard of anything needing a .445 ball and I've had bp guns since the late 60's. I have a .44 made in 1969 that takes .454 balls and two .36's made in 76 that take .375 balls. No Italian gun has the correct chamber diameter for the bore except for the shooters models.
 
M

mudduckie

New member
Hellgate said:
It may be a Walker made from a kit and not proofed. I doubt ASM was making reproductions much before the 1960s. I don't believe any original percussion revolvers ever wrote "Black Powder Only" on their barrels because black was the only powder out there. I owned an ASM Walker about 25 years ago but the cylinder started rubbing on the frame so I considered it poorly made, sold it, and bought a pair of Ubertis and never looked back. Yours may fetch a couple hundred bucks or more but it is no antique.
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Dang I did not think of the black powder only part! Makes perfect sense. Thank you for the insight. I looked for ASM kits and can't find where any were offered in the walker.
 
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