9mm vs. 357 mag

[cajun47]

im not here to put down either round. i have several 9mm handguns and like them. but im thinking of buying a small 357 revolver or a kel-tek 9mm for concealed carry.

http://www.recguns.com/Sources/VIIE8.html

in that chart the 357 doesn't seem to be that much more powerful but i have no idea how those numbers translate in real life use. lets say 9mm+p+ hollow point vs. a 357 mag hollow point. would the 357 create a much bigger wound and stop/put down the bg faster than the 9mm?

i know some people hunt with 357 mags but i never hear of anyone hunting with a 9mm. im not reading these charts right?

 

[fisherman66]

9 mm 95 1295 353.3
115 1180 355.1
115 1225 382.7
125 1165 376.2
147 1010 332.5

9mm+p 115 1325 447.7
147 1030 345.8

357 Mag 110 1295 409.1
125 1450 582.8
145 1290 535.1
158 1235 534.4
180 1180 555.8

I guess it's all about how you define "much more".

I might argue that a 38+p is a better carry choice than a .357, but I am not in the mood to argue today. They will all do a fine job as a CCW. I'd spend more time looking at platforms and find what you prefer in your hand.

 

[ZeSpectre]

Apples and Oranges.
It is my understanding that a 9mm self defense load and a +P .38 special load are pretty similar though.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

What are you talking about?

According to that chart, the 9mm's 147 grain bullet only hits with 345 ft. pounds of energy. Whereas the 357 mag's 145 grain bullet hits with 535 ft. pounds of force. That's getting close to twice as much "punch" for roughly the same weight bullet. That seems like a pretty significant difference to me.

 

[john in jax]

The diameter of the 2 rounds is very close but the .357 allows you to shoot heavier/longer bullets (research sectional density) as fast, or faster. The .357 offers the POTENTIAL for much more penetration - that is what makes the .357 a better hunting round.

 

[john55555]

You've got the 9mm covered. Get a S&W Model 60 and you're good to go for concealed carry in either .357 or .38 and it's variations.

 

[BigJimP]

I think the .357 in 158 gr hits a lot harder - and others have given you the specs. I think a .357 round in a revolver is a good choice - but the smaller frame revolver you get - the more recoil you get.

Partly what makes the .357 a nice gun is you can shoot .38's in it for practice and maybe run part of a box thru it will full .357 loads as well.

If you've already got a 9mm why not try something different.

 

[Half-Price Assassin]

my advice to you, get a GLOCK 27, or even an M&Pc .40sw. unless you just want a wheelgun. the 9mm is a great round, i sleep next to one every night, but .40, .357(sig & mag), and .45acp, are better. you should rent a small .357mag first before you buy, i hear they have alot of kick.

 

[PzGren]

Fisherman,

what are the barrel lengthes for that data?

 

[glockman19]

Get a S&W or Ruger Revolver in .357 and you can still shoot the .38.

 

[Majic]

Don't let the numbers fool you. You said you are looking at the small .357 magnum revolvers. In the shorter barrels the magnum round will not generate that kind of velocity. Most charts are for the 4" to 6" barrel revolvers. The snubs will generate a lot of recoil and muzzle blast. Full power magnum loads in most small frame revolvers are not real pleasant to shoot. The +P .38 spl loads does an excellent job without the rip and roar of the magnum.

 

[john55555]

I'll give Majic's observation a big "amen" regarding the recoil of a "J" frame Model 60. However, you mentioned .357 and concealment and that would fit the bill. On the other hand, depending on your build, a good used .357 Model 65-3 "K" frame would be ideal. Rubber grips either way. I mention the Model 65-3 only because I'm partial! There's a variety of more current model .357's that would be excellent.

 

[Boarhunter]

cajun47,

Relative "foot pounds of energy" is obviously an important criteria in evaluating your options, but I would suggest that an issue at least as important is your ability to comfortably and accurately handle the two cartridges being considered. A snubby 357 revolver handles entirely different from a 9 mm semi-automatic handgun, even a very small and lightweight 9 mm such as the Kel-Tec PF-9. And a miss with a 357 (or a 41 mag or a 50 S&W mag) is far less effective than even the least of the 9 mm cartridges.

So, assuming you are a decent shooter with 9 mm semi-automatic weapons, I would not necessarily jump ship on them unless and until I satisfied myself that I was both comfortable and competent with the snubby revolver.

Something to think about.

Boarhunter

 

[juliet charley]

Here are some short barrel .357 Magnum figures:

158gr. Speer Uni-core, (Gold Dot) hollow cavity, bullet
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel—1,015 fps (361 ft. lbs.)

140gr. Sierra JHC bullet (jacketed hollow cavity)
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel—1,088 fps (368 ft. lbs.)

125gr. Speer Unicore (Gold Dot) bullet
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel— 1,109 fps (341 ft. lbs.)

Of course, going to a Kel-Tec will mean losing MV/ME off the published 9x19 figures too (because published figures are normally obtained from a 4 to 4.5 inch barrel).

If you plan on shooting .357 Magnums, I would strongly recommend you avoid the various light-weight alloy (aluminum, scandium, etc.) revolvers and stick with steel frame versions. To go further, the only "pocket revolver" I would ever consider for actually shooting .357 Magnums is the Ruger SP101.

 

[mlandman]

If you hit the BG in the COM once and sholder once with a 357 are you better off than 2 COM hits with a 9? Rent and try!
An Air weight (340pd or similar) will slap your hand, perhaps to the point of too little practice.

Too little practice = poor accuracy = no stop and/or go to jail for hitting the person near the BG.

 

[givo08]

Don't be fooled by the statistics on a website, you need to look at chrono data out of the actual gun/barrel length you are going to carry. The above was posted for .357 gold dots:

125gr. Speer Unicore (Gold Dot) bullet
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel— 1,109 fps (341 ft. lbs.)

Here's some data on 9mm out of a glock 26:
G26 3.5" Barrel, 5 shot strings
9mm Winchester Ranger 127gr +P+ JHP, MPN#RA9TA
Avg Vel 1216, SD 5, ES 10

Here's another test by another person of gold dots out of a G26:
Gold Dot 124+p
Avg Vel 1201

Same bullet weight/diameter, in one example it's the exact same bullet design and you're getting 100 FPS faster in 9mm. .357 is designed for 4+" barrels. Any less and you're going to be getting a lot of noise and recoil without much benefit.

 

[jem375]

It is not the same diameter, but close enough.... and I have some 125 gr. gold dot ammo from DT that puts out 1600 FPS out of a 4" barrel for the 357 magnum and the 9MM can't even come close to that. Even out of a shorter barrel this ammo will be faster than the fastest of 9MM.

 

[Feanaro]

125gr. Speer Unicore (Gold Dot) bullet
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel— 1,109 fps (341 ft. lbs.)

Here's some data on 9mm out of a glock 26:
G26 3.5" Barrel, 5 shot strings
9mm Winchester Ranger 127gr +P+ JHP, MPN#RA9TA
Avg Vel 1216, SD 5, ES 10

Same bullet weight/diameter, in one example it's the exact same bullet design and you're getting 100 FPS faster in 9mm.

Gee, I wonder why.

The same .357 load gets 1,322 fps out of a 3 inch barrel. It could be loaded even hotter. It can be loaded even hotter, if you've got the hands to hold onto it.

 

[Tanzer]

I second what majic said. .357's give a heck of a kick. If you practice with 38 specials then shoot a few .357's, you'll probably find yourself flinching in anticipation of recoil, and you'll have that much more in the back of your mind to worry about in a SD situation. I even find them punchy in my big heavy S&W 686. The concussion knocks dust off the ceiling at the range. I'm used to it, but I use it primarily for carry in the woods, and carry a .45acp semi normally. The .357 also runs the slight risk of overpentration harming innocents, and as stated earlier, if you miss your target you may as well be holding a rubber duck. Have you considered a .45?

 

[springmom]

if you miss your target you may as well be holding a rubber duck.

You know, this REALLY needs to be a sig line...

I have a S&W 66-3. Nice, sturdy gun. I can shoot regular .38's out of it all day long without a problem. Even +P .38's are fine. .357's are OK. Not something I'd go through a box of 50 at a time, mind you, but OK.

I also have a m37, little airweight J-frame. Regular .38's start to hurt at about 40-50 rounds. +P's are miserable. I practice with them because it's often my carry gun in the summer, but I don't enjoy it. In that m37, .38spl. +P's hurt worse than .357's out of the 66-3.

I do not even want to THINK what shooting a .357 out of a J frame would be like. I certainly don't ever want to DO it.

If you want a .357 (and everybody should have one at some point, they're just about as versatile as a gun comes) get something heavy enough and large enough to absorb the recoil. Avoid the J-frames for this. Your hands will thank you.

Springmom