I traded for an unusual revolver today. It looks like a 4 screw 1905 S&W, but it has no markings whatsoever. There is a serial number on the butt by the lanyard ring, and a few numbers on the cylinder, but no proofs or letters of any kind. It has an H on the grips, and a coil mainspring. The guy I got it from said it was a 32-20 and he had fired 32-20 ammo through it before. Even threw in 3 boxes of ammo. The bore looked too big to me and shure enough, an unsized 32 cast bullet fell through the bore. I slugged it at .330, and COTW confirms it is a 8mm Lebel. Just for grins I fired a cylinder of 32-20 ammo through it. All 6 tumbled (of course) and gave me a nice 2'x4' group at 10 yards. The revolver looks well made, better than the usual Spanish or Belgium knockoffs. Anybody know anything about this revolver?
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8mm Lebel S&W clone
- Thread starter JohnMoses
- Start date
Mike Irwin
Staff
Most likely it is Belgian.
It is probably Spanish, sold during WWI to the French, who were desperate for handguns to use in trench fighting. The quality is probably not very high, and most of those guns are made of cast iron. After that war, the Spanish makers began shipping those S&W copies into the U.S., changing the caliber to either .38 Special or .32-20. Many of them have blown up over the years and my very strong suggestion is that it not be fired with any cartridge, even the rather weak 8mm Lebel.
Jim
Jim
Mike Irwin
Staff
Both pre and post WW I the Belgians also made significant numbers of S&W clones in 8mm Lebel for sale in Europe but primarily for dumping in Africa and the Middle East where there was significant French influence.
Mike Irwin
Staff
But, if it was made in Europe, it's going to have proof marks on it somewhere unless it was polished to hell and back and hell again.
Open the cylinder and look at the rear of the cylinder (the end you load cartridges into). It was pretty common to stamp proof markings there.
How about some good, clear pictures?
Open the cylinder and look at the rear of the cylinder (the end you load cartridges into). It was pretty common to stamp proof markings there.
How about some good, clear pictures?
Jim Watson
New member
I have read on the Internet and therefore it must be so, that when the Spanish put .32-20 revolvers into the American and South American markets they used 8mm barrels. From this OP, maybe 8mm cylinders, nothing changed but the label.
It would be interesting to get some measurements off one of the .32-20s to see if that were so.
It would be interesting to get some measurements off one of the .32-20s to see if that were so.
I have only seen two of those in .32-20 and the chambers were correct. I don't know about the barrels, though. COTW says the .32-20 bullet is .312 and the 8mm Lebel is .323, so the 8mm barrel would not be very accurate (not that the maker or the importer really cared about such silly things anyway).
Jim
Jim
Reloading for that puppy oughta prove downright interesting...
It looks like .32-20 cases can be used, but the bore diameter starts at .325" and appears to increase from there. The published specs are 100-115 grains at 700 f/s, making it an emphatic .32 ACP.
Neat piece of history, though. Makes me wish firearms could speak English, sometimes, so I could know where they've been.
It looks like .32-20 cases can be used, but the bore diameter starts at .325" and appears to increase from there. The published specs are 100-115 grains at 700 f/s, making it an emphatic .32 ACP.
Neat piece of history, though. Makes me wish firearms could speak English, sometimes, so I could know where they've been.