64 gr Nosler BSB - powder suggestion

[603Country]

I have an AR, 16” barrel, in 223/5.56. It’ll shoot 63 gr and 65 gr Sierra bullets like a dream, using H335 powder. So naturally it should also shoot the Nosler 64 gr BSB great also, right? Well, it won’t, so I’ll try another powder. My on-hand choices are IMR 3031, BL-C(2), and IMR4064. And I have a tiny bit of Varget, but not enough to actually use. I’m thinking the BL-C(2) is worth a try. The 4064 will be too slow. The 3031 might work, though it’ll be a compressed load.

Anybody use any of these powders with that bullet? Of course, I’d use other more fitting powders if I could get them, but you know how it is these days.

 

[Shadow9mm]

What are you meaning by it won't shoot? Bad velocities es/sd? Or it wont group well? Large groups? Fliers? What size groups does the gun normally produce?

If the gun shoots well with that powder and similar bullet weights that would point to the bullet, not powder to me. Tuning the seating depth to your guns harmonics would be my plan.

I would try adjusting seating depth before changing powders if the velocities are consistent. Seat deeper in 0.003 increments, try 5 seating depths of 5rounds each. Start 0.003 deeper than where you are now.


Bl-c(2) and cfe223 are what i am getting ready to test with some hornady 75g match bullets. Keep in mind bl-c(2) and cfe223 both perform much more consistently with magnum primers.

 

[603Country]

I have to admit that I have not considered adjusting the COAL. I’ll give that a try. The 63 and 65 gr Sierras group into 3/4” or less. The 64’s group in to 1 1/2” or worse. Yesterday, just to be sure it wasn’t just poor shooting on my part or a too-dirty barrel, I grabbed two 63 gr loads and put them dead center in the bullseye and in about the same hole. So, the 64 gr loads are the problem, not me or the barrel. I had wanted to use H335 for this load because I shoot the 223 a lot and I have a bunch of H335.

Let me give some thought to a COAL change.

Primers are CCI 41’s. Cases are newish Lapua.

 

[603Country]

Shadow, you are a smart guy. The Sierra 63’s and 65’s that shoot so well are seated further out, a fact that I hadn’t noticed. I used Nosler’s “tested OAL” of 2.175” at first, since Nosler data has generally been very useful. Well, I wasted a lot of bullets making shotgun type patterns. This morning I shot 3 rounds with the best of the bad loads and got a 2” group. Moved the OAL out to 2.18” and it tightened up noticeably. Moved it out to 2.21” and a tighter group still. Moved it to 2.215, and bingo. Great group that prints exactly where the 63 gr Sierras print, and since the rifle is sighted in for the 63’s, I’ll stop right here.

Much thanks! Don’t have any idea why a COAL change didn’t occur to me. I will shoot a hog in your honor.

 

[Shadow9mm]

People always seem to try and tweak a powder load, change powders, or even just say there gun does not like a certain bullet if something is not shooting well. I aim for a powder charge that has a good SD and ES, and tweak the seating. Had limited supplies for a while had to figure out how to make what I could get my hands on shoot well in my guns. I credit the technique to eric cortina on YouTube, i have learned a lot from him. I had a rifle that would not group better than 1.25 at 100 with match ammo or hand loads, after using the technique i am down to 0.75in groups at 100 and have not yet found a bullet that wont shoot well.

Happy I could help and good hunting!

 

[Shadow9mm]

Picked up a pound of H335 to play with. Love benchmark, but can't get any and noticed this was right next to it on the burn rate chart. Gonna try it with some 55 and 75g bullets in 223 as well as the CFE223 and BL-c(2). Going to start putting some loads together tomorrow.

 

[603Country]

H335 is my favorite 223 powder. Maybe it’s because I have good loads for many bullets. And, thanks to you, I have the good load for the 64 gr Nosler. Other powders I tried were A2230, Varget, and BL-C(2). The A2230 gave great results, but I didn’t have much of it, and I was able to get plenty H335. The BL-C(2) just never gave me great accuracy, which could have been my fault.

The accuracy node for the 63 and 65 gr Sierras and the 64 gr Nosler was at 24.2 or 24.3 gr of the H335. And those loads also shoot great with those same bullets in my 223 bolt gun. It’s a ways from a max load, but in both rifles it’s a warm load, so work up to it.

 

[jetinteriorguy]

In my 18” .223 Wylde criterion barrel I’ve found it’s basically a tossup between Varget and H4895 with a slight nod to H4895 using bullets in this weight range.

 

[Shadow9mm]

H335 is my favorite 223 powder. Maybe it’s because I have good loads for many bullets. And, thanks to you, I have the good load for the 64 gr Nosler. Other powders I tried were A2230, Varget, and BL-C(2). The A2230 gave great results, but I didn’t have much of it, and I was able to get plenty H335. The BL-C(2) just never gave me great accuracy, which could have been my fault.

The accuracy node for the 63 and 65 gr Sierras and the 64 gr Nosler was at 24.2 or 24.3 gr of the H335. And those loads also shoot great with those same bullets in my 223 bolt gun. It’s a ways from a max load, but in both rifles it’s a warm load, so work up to it.

From my reading and experience BL-c(2) performs best with magnum primers. In my testing in 308 I had an average SD of 13.85 over 8 groups with it. I can't say on groups, that rifle would not shoot, anything under 1moa, long story. With it being close in burn rate to Varget I'm hoping it will perform well with the 75s.

I'm loading test loads now with BL-c(2), cfe223, and h335. Once I get all my testing done I will make a new thread with my results.

75s are a lot of bullet to cram in that little case....

 

[Shadow9mm]

In my 18” .223 Wylde criterion barrel I’ve found it’s basically a tossup between Varget and H4895 with a slight nod to H4895 using bullets in this weight range.

I love varget, but i have not seen any in over a year, i started looking for h4895 6 months ago, not a hint. Cfe223, bl-c(2), and h335 are all available at this point and i have a reasonable ammount of the first 2 on hand to work with.

 

[jetinteriorguy]

I’ve been thinking of trying H335 since I have about 14lbs of it on the shelf. Up to now I’ve only used it with 55gr bullets, only recently have heard it’s good for heavier projectiles. Back in the 80’s I used Blc—2 in both .223 and 7.62x39 with good results.

 

[9MMand223only]

The 3031 is going to be the best for that, for what you have. And it won't even be close. In terms of accuracy.

You want to go with a load and find what it likes between 22.0 and 23.0 grains using that bullet.

Among the ball powders, 2230 will work "good" but 2460 is better for that bullet. Here is what the top tier powder choices would be for that bullet:
Stick:
N135
Benchmark
AR Comp
H4895
XBR 8208

Ball
TAC
AA2460
AA2230
H335


People just love Varget. But no, its only useful for 69 grain and heavier bullets. And you won't get the velocity of it using less grain bullet, and case fill is not ideal. Varget not top tier powder for under 69 grain, sorry.

 

[603Country]

I can’t say with conviction what powder is the absolute best, but I can say that H335 has turned out to be a great choice for the bullets I shoot - 40 gr Nosler BT, 63 gr Sierra SMP, 64 gr Nosler BSB, and 65 gr Sierra GK. I also tried it with some 69 gr Hornady match bullets, but results weren’t anything special.

I tried IMR3031, but forget what bullet I used. It was nothing special. The A2230 under the 65 gr Sierra GK gave super accuracy in my bolt gun’s first barrel.

I’m saving the BL-C(2) for the 6.5 grendel. I might try the 3031 too, but it might be a bit too fast burning. For now, the 3031 gets used in the grandson’s 308.

 

[Shadow9mm]

Im looking forward to trying the h335. Hopefully wed or thurs this week. Will try it with some 55g fmj as well when i get time to prep some more brass. I hate trimming.

 

[Shadow9mm]

Got out and did testing today. Posted a new thread to try and keep things simple and make it easier for others to see the data.
https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6912476#post6912476