I fired some reloaded Hornady XTP 200gr bullets out of my .45 Colt/.410 Judge with a 3-inch barrel. Used 6.7 gr of Tite-Group and CCI 300 LRP. Bullets grouped 4" to the left of my point of aim. Some of the cases were extremely sooty. The Hornady box labeled them .451". Would things improve in accuracy and dirty cases if I used .452 diameter?
.451 vs .452?
- Thread starter cdoc42
- Start date
I would have to say, probably. Try these.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/77...er-250-grain-jacketed-hollow-point-box-of-100
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/77...er-250-grain-jacketed-hollow-point-box-of-100
Sooty cases usually indicates low pressure - the case doesn't expand fully to seal the chamber - so using faster powder or different bullet might help. But in my experience one thou is not much difference to produce noticeable results ( with the same type, construction and weight of bullet), sometimes bullets differ more than 1-2 thou in diameter in the same batch.
Another thing is the TG is not the cleanest burning powder, especially at low pressures - try switch to different powder, I had great results with Trail Boss for low pressure target loads.
Another thing is the TG is not the cleanest burning powder, especially at low pressures - try switch to different powder, I had great results with Trail Boss for low pressure target loads.
maggys drawers
New member
I got sooty cases with TG in my Judge, too. I switched to Power Pistol and the problem went away. I also shoot the 250 grn XTP''s in it.
.45 Colt/.410 Judge
Larger diameter bullets, .452" will make no difference. You are working with a very long chamber made for the 410. The bullets have to jump a long distance in free space to reach the forcing come. Way to long for accuracy. You may want to check over here > http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8 An oversized cast bullet may help some. The T/C contender in 45/410 is about the same as your Judge.
Larger diameter bullets, .452" will make no difference. You are working with a very long chamber made for the 410. The bullets have to jump a long distance in free space to reach the forcing come. Way to long for accuracy. You may want to check over here > http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8 An oversized cast bullet may help some. The T/C contender in 45/410 is about the same as your Judge.
The .410 area of the chamber is .011" larger than the .452" throat of the 45 Colt. See SAAMI drawing here > http://www.saami.org/PubResources/CC_Drawings/Pistol/45%20Colt.pdf and http://www.saami.org/PubResources/CC_Drawings/Shotshell/410%20Bore%202_1-2.pdf
Generally speaking what causes cases to split is flaring more than is necessary to start a bullet and crimping more than is needed. The mouth of the case becomes work hardened and brittle and will start cracking. Expansion from firing and resizing when reloading have very little effect on case life. I have .45 ACP, .44 Spl., and .41 Mag. cases I have been reloading since the late 1980s and none have split yet. Some of the .45 ACP brass I have been using has been reloaded at least 50 times or more and and never failed. Look into Lyman's M-step expander die. With these you cannot over flare the mouth. They will greatly increase case life and make loading bullets into the case much easier. And only crimp lightly, just enough to remove the flare and straighten the case wall out.
What 243 was trying to explain to you is; the chamber of a judge or any other 45 colt/.410 gun is a compromise chamber. It HAS to be built like it is.
This results in an extremely long freebore before the bullet encounters the barrel and rifling. That alone doesn't mean much IF the freebore was .452 in diameter. As 243 says, it's much bigger! .011 means the bore is .463! That makes for a loose fit for the 45 colt bullet. Plus, it is not spinning yet, just sliding down an oversize bore.
This allows something else to happen, powder gasses going past the bullet. So the best powder for the colt load would be something very fast , so that the powder is mostly consumed before the bullet leaves the case. Red-dot. 700-X, nitro-100 or even bullseye would work best.
This results in an extremely long freebore before the bullet encounters the barrel and rifling. That alone doesn't mean much IF the freebore was .452 in diameter. As 243 says, it's much bigger! .011 means the bore is .463! That makes for a loose fit for the 45 colt bullet. Plus, it is not spinning yet, just sliding down an oversize bore.
This allows something else to happen, powder gasses going past the bullet. So the best powder for the colt load would be something very fast , so that the powder is mostly consumed before the bullet leaves the case. Red-dot. 700-X, nitro-100 or even bullseye would work best.
The 45 Colt chamber is about .4806" in diameter. The 410 is about .4630" So the 45 is larger in that area. I would guess that case life will be normal. Different powder, like snuffy said, may cut down on the extremely sooty condition. After the bullet leaves the case mouth, it has to travel about 1.125" in an oversize 410 chamber, measuring .011" larger than bullet diameter (.463" -.452") Not good for accuracy.
