30-06 with cast bullets?

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Shadow9mm

New member
So i have decided to add to my list of reloading projects and ordered a lee .309 170g flat point bullet mold, a .309 sizer and some gas checks. They will be powder coated. Hoping to use them for some 100yd plinking.

As i understand from my reading these need to be slower than traditional 30-06, more in the 2200fps or less range.

Not sure what powders to use. I have on hand, big game, bl-c(2) cfe223, h335, hp-38, power pistol, aa#7, cfe pistol, and h110. Are any of these viable options?

From my reading unique or 2400 seem to be a good choices and i think i can get some. I dont want to get a bunch of powders to tinker with. And preferably ones i can use standard primers with.

What are my options?
 
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44 AMP

Staff
Best options initially, get a Lyman manual or an RCBS cast bullet handbook.

As i understand from my reading these need to be slower than traditional 30-06, more in the 2200fps or less range.
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Expect less...Lead bullets are not jacketed bullets and you simply cannot drive them as fast with acceptable results.

Lyman Reloading Handbook 45th Edition (1970)
.30-06, 173gr cast w/gas check #2 alloy bullet # 311291
powders listed are
Hi Skor 700x
PB
SR 7625
SR 4756
Red Dot
Unique
2400
Green Dot
Herco

the listing for the 193gr bullet also includes IMR 4227 and IMR 4198.

Velocity taken from a Universal Receiver with a 26" barrel

Max loads from most of the powders were in the high 1500fps range. A couple 1600s, one in the mid 1800s (Unique) and one at 2155fps (2400)

MAX charge weights were in the 12-14gr range for most, bit over 16gr for Unique, and a bit over 27gr for 2400. MAX charges. Pressures in the 33-36K range. NOT max pressure for the gun, but max pressure for those loads.

Remember that these are loads intended for short range plinking, and small game hunting and are not even remotely trying to be full power stuff.

you are, essentially using a small pinch of pistol powder which comes nowhere near recommended case fill. There are some risks involved in this.

There are loads with more usual rifle powders for cast bullets, I just don't have any handy at the moment.

With the right loads it is possible to get cast bullets (gas checked and of the correct alloy) up to near .30-30 speeds at a max. Push them faster and you won't like the results. Leading, accuracy loss due to bullets stripping the rifling, that kind of thing.

Get a couple of good books on the subject, and go to the cast bullet forums for current advice.

I shoot cast in handguns and also my .45-70 and .458 Win Mag rifles. haven't bothered with them in .30 cal since I was 15 and had a bad "boo-boo" because I thought I knew more than I did. Still have the hugely ruptured case as a reminder.

Good luck, the data is out there, but if you go the pistol powder route, be DAMN sure only ONE charge gets in each case, because with charges that small in a case as big as the 06, you really can't see a mistake.

Trust me on this, a double charge will ruin your day and hurt your gun, and maybe you, possibly badly. More than that could lead to a life altering permanent event.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
I have the lyman book, and have been reading forum posts from all over. Just looking for something fun to punch some paper with and try something new.

Im not complaining about the velocity. Just trying to say that i understand the limitations . Puts me in a position where i need a new powder, as the starting loads with my rifle powder are even too fast.

Dont mind tinkering with loads a bit, just looking for a good powder option so i don't waste time and component trying to reinvent the wheel.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
TX Nimrod said:
Another option is to ask on a cast bullet board. You will get plenty of experienced responses here:

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?8-Cast-Boolits




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I hear that a lot. generally any cast questions, whether they are in the cast bullet section, or reloading related I get referred to castboolits. I know they specialize in that but if feel like it marginalizes our forum here, and there is no reason we cant have a good cast bullet community here as well rather than pushing people to other sites. But it has to be built and shared, and if people don't ask and share here when they can that will never happen.
 
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TX Nimrod

New member
Oh, I get that. But what about this - you learn what you can from expert casters anywhere, then bring your learnings here to this board. That way you get more expansive information, and the rest of us get to learn from you. The board experience grows - instead of repeating only what our members already know….




.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
TX Nimrod said:
Oh, I get that. But what about this - you learn what you can from expert casters anywhere, then bring your learnings here to this board. That way you get more expansive information, and the rest of us get to learn from you. The board experience grows - instead of repeating only what our members already know….




.
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That is exactly what I am trying to do. However your statement presumes that there is no one here with the knowledge to pass on. The only way to know is to ask. I am researching in many places as well as here, and will be sharing what I learn here. But I am currently at the point of knowledge without experience, and its a precarious place to be. I want to learn everything I can especially from people here that I am familiar with, before starting down this road.
 
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Paul B.

New member
Shooting cast bullets is an almost never ending learning process. I've been casting since 1954 and am still learning. That's what makes it not only interesting but fun.

I used to use SR4759 quite a bit but the powers that be discontinued it. These days I use 5744 in the 30-06 for cast bullets. If you can find some, try 25.0 gr. with your bullet. I run 25.0 gr. with three different bullets, a 180, 190 or a 220 gr. bullet in the 30-06. That does required changing the scope setting but that's no big deal. I really like working with that 220 gr. bullet (Lyman 311284) and 5744 powder. Rifle is a Browning B78 single shot and the load is showing some promise. I haven't bothered with checking the velocity yet, just trying to see what the load will do on paper.
BTW, according to things I've read, 5744 is probably the best replacement for SR4759.
Paul B.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
Paul B. said:
Shooting cast bullets is an almost never ending learning process. I've been casting since 1954 and am still learning. That's what makes it not only interesting but fun.

I used to use SR4759 quite a bit but the powers that be discontinued it. These days I use 5744 in the 30-06 for cast bullets. If you can find some, try 25.0 gr. with your bullet. I run 25.0 gr. with three different bullets, a 180, 190 or a 220 gr. bullet in the 30-06. That does required changing the scope setting but that's no big deal. I really like working with that 220 gr. bullet (Lyman 311284) and 5744 powder. Rifle is a Browning B78 single shot and the load is showing some promise. I haven't bothered with checking the velocity yet, just trying to see what the load will do on paper.
BTW, according to things I've read, 5744 is probably the best replacement for SR4759.
Paul B.
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Thank you, that's not a powder I can say I am familiar with. Have it added into my notes so I can do some more digging!
 
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reddog81

New member
Unique and 2400 work well with cast bullet loads in .30-06. Unique works well in the 1,200+/- FPS range and 2400 does good around 1,500 FPS. I haven't ever seen much regarding the other powders mentioned in the OP. 10 grains Unique with a 170 grain bullet in .30-06 is about one step up in recoil from a .22lr

5744 would probably be a good choice for moderate loads. It looks like Hodgdons online resource even has loads for it. I use 5744 in 450 BM for 285 to 300 grain cast bullet loads in the 1,500 FPS range and it works better than a number of other powders I've tried.
 
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Jim Watson

New member
From what you list, I would try Power Pistol.
I have not had good results from Ball powders in light loads. A friend had hagnfires trying to make a .458 into a .45-70 with Ball C2.
 
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gwpercle

New member
My 1903-A3 Springfield 30-06 likes that Lee 170 gr. F GC , sized .309"

over : 13 grs.(1510 fps) to a max of 15 grs. (1634 fps) - Red Dot
........ 15 grs. (1607 fps) to a max of 17.0 grs. (1735 fps) - Unique
........ 22 grs.(1843 fps) to a max of 24 grs (1986 fps) - 2400

My rifles 2 groove military barrel seems to have a accuracy "sweet spot" with that bullet at around 1600 to 1650 fps reguardless of the powder used ...
I like Red Dot and Unique best ... but Accurate #5 powder shows promise and could be a winner !
Gary
 
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Wendyj

New member
I've got about a hundred gas checked 175 grain bullets I was going to use in a 30-30 but decided against it. These are lubed though and I think they are sized .311 due to micro groove. NOE mold if not mistaken. Never got over 13-1400 fps second without losing accuracy.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
44 AMP said:
there is a cast bullet subforum here, you can find it at the top of the handloading forum page.
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So I am slightly confused.

I am clear we have a cast bullet section, I have posted in here before.

The title states "Bullet Casting - For all those that cast, swage, or otherwise form their own projectiles. Tips on molds, sizers, bullet alloys, lubes and what-have-you." it does not mention loads.

Also I have asked about lead bullet loads for 38, 357, 44spl, and 44mag in the handloading section before, and seen many threads on loads with lead bullets in the reloading section as well.

I guess I just figured as I was asking for load data, not specifics on casting the bullets, it would be in the handloading section. My apologies if I was incorrect. And if you thing this is a better place for it I have no issue with that. It just seems to be different from how I have seen it done in the past.
 
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Unclenick

Staff
No biggie. It could be in either place. It is just that shooting cast bullets in higher velocity rifle cartridges tends to get a little more specialized with recommendations and techniques, so the hardcore casters are more likely to be able to help with it.
 
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