3 interesting articles in 24 Feb Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

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alan

New member
The following articles appeared in 24 February Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (www.post-gazette.com)

First headlined A frame-up falls apart, page 1, main section. Second article headlined Complaints about agent date to start of his career. Both of these articles deal with drug prosecutions and what appear to be horrendous miscarriages of justice. It also appears that the prosecutor, U.S. Attorney Greg White, who blew the whistle, is something of that now an then mentioned “stand-up guy”. A third article, this one headlined Can armed students stop campus gun tragedies, would likely be of interest to many here.

The three articles, above referenced can be viewed at the papers web site/on-line edition. Go to www.post-gazette.com)
 
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Caeser23

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Colleges are rife with binge drinking parties and with young people pressured by everything from grades to romantic breakups. Imagine adding weapons to the equation, said Peter Hamm, spokesman for the Washington D.C.-based Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

"Anyone who has gone to college knows this is a terrible, terrible potential mix," he said. "These young people are flat out wrong."


:barf: but of course it's a quote from the brady bunch, being a responsbile gun owner means doing it legally, b/c you know, drinking alcohol and carrying isn't against the law:rolleyes:
 
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toybox99615

New member
college campuses

I have real mixed concerns over the college campus drinking/drug reality and RKBA. My concern begins with first the number of students who are not going to legally carry as most state restrict CCW to those over 21. Without proof I will submit (IMO) that half of the undergraduates on most campuses are under 21. Then I know the potential for problems when guns and alcohol mix.

I'm sure there is a balance on how to provide RKBA and how to maintain a control over who is carrying and drinking simultaneously. I just can not see how to accomplish the task of managing both. College campuses can barley deal with the alcohol and drug problems. And most local police already have more issues with college parties than they can handle. Add a need to patrol who is packing at these parties and I see uncontrolled chaos.

The alternative I see is colleges and local communities will have to add considerably more personnel to insure the drinking and guns are not an issue. I'm not sure we are willing to bear the cost of that option at every college campus around the country.

We already know the difficulty of maintaining relative peace at a high visibility sports event where the spectators end up in massive brawls when students and alcohol are together. I don't want to deny anyone the rights they have. I just don't like the potential this mix seems to hold.
 
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alan

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Caeser23 wrote/quoted:

Colleges are rife with binge drinking parties and with young people pressured by everything from grades to romantic breakups. Imagine adding weapons to the equation, said Peter Hamm, spokesman for the Washington D.C.-based Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

"Anyone who has gone to college knows this is a terrible, terrible potential mix," he said. "These young people are flat out wrong."


but of course it's a quote from the brady bunch, being a responsbile gun owner means doing it legally, b/c you know, drinking alcohol and carrying isn't against the law

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Re quotes from the anti gun lobby, exampled by The Brady Campaign among others, they have, with more than a little justification, been accused of dancing in the blood of victims before. Seems as if they might be at it still. Additionally, respecting the anti gun views held by some college students, I expect that they would look upon such as things written on tablets of gold, received directly from god. Finally, are you certain that college students these days, it's been a very long time since I was one such, are as dumb, irresponsible as some would have them?
 
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alan

New member
toybox99615 writes on college campuses:



I have real mixed concerns over the college campus drinking/drug reality and RKBA. My concern begins with first the number of students who are not going to legally carry as most state restrict CCW to those over 21. Without proof I will submit (IMO) that half of the undergraduates on most campuses are under 21. Then I know the potential for problems when guns and alcohol mix.

I'm sure there is a balance on how to provide RKBA and how to maintain a control over who is carrying and drinking simultaneously. I just can not see how to accomplish the task of managing both. College campuses can barley deal with the alcohol and drug problems. And most local police already have more issues with college parties than they can handle. Add a need to patrol who is packing at these parties and I see uncontrolled chaos.

The alternative I see is colleges and local communities will have to add considerably more personnel to insure the drinking and guns are not an issue. I'm not sure we are willing to bear the cost of that option at every college campus around the country.

We already know the difficulty of maintaining relative peace at a high visibility sports event where the spectators end up in massive brawls when students and alcohol are together. I don't want to deny anyone the rights they have. I just don't like the potential this mix seems to hold.

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While it's been a very long time since I was a college student, I suspect that while some might be "piss heads" as some British acquaintences would have it, others might be dopers also, I suspect that the majority of college students are neither. I also expect that, in general, while I might strongly disagfrwee with the views of some, that they are fairly level headed, on the whole.

As to the age requirements you mentioned, there is that, though given that 18 year olds can marry, enter into contracts, join the military and so forth, the fact that they cannot, in any jurisdictions, enjoy a beer and a sandwich doresn't make much sense. Telliong someone of that age that they are not old enough to own a handgun, absent other arguments is, in my view, questionable too. Of course, we might disagree on ths however it seems to e that the creation of "gun free zones" seems to create a safer working place for criminals. It also might be described as creating, for those intent on criminal violence, defenseless victims.

I submit that our society has to choose re what it is that it wants to do. I do not believe that this decision can be trusted to political types either, sad to note.
 
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Garand Illusion

New member
LIke has been said ... in most states, barring unusual circumstances (like in Colorado a person who gets an "emergency" CCW because they are in danger), a person under the age of 21 can't legally carry a concealed weapon. The ones who would do it illegally already do so.

I was also a college student. I partied it up from time to time and also had my .22 pistol buried in a drawer in my dorm room. But quite simply I was a responsible gun owner even then and never got it out if the beer was flowing. Back then I didn't even consider it a self defense tool, as I was too sure of my own ability to defend myself. It was just a bottle/can plinker.

So the fear the Brady Campaign is trying to build about college students being too irresponsible to own guns (but then, they think 45 year old surbabnites are also to irresonsible to own guns) is just another red herring. It's not a concern. Irresponsible students who don't care about the law already have gun if they want them. On campus or off.

All this will do, like all CCW laws, is allow law abiding, responsible people who wouldn't break the law to carry ... carry. These are the people who will save lives if they have a weapon and something happens. These are the people every father/mother should WANT to be carrying a gun on the campus their child attends. The students and professors over the age of 21 who CARE about the law and are responsible enough to get a license.
 
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toybox99615

New member
It not just the Brady campaign

to claim the only people in the country who question guns on campus are those fostering the Brady Campaign is a far cry from the truth. There are substantial differences between banning all firearms and concerns over limitations. Trying to imply the logic that all those who question the guns on campus approach as supporting Brady is a very narrow view.

When you eliminate the possibility that there may not be some middle ground in the all or nothing RKBA issues those who are in the middle will not be rallying to the all side. They will fall to the wayside and loose interest in supporting the RKBA. Loosing any support is not beneficial.
 
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