.22wmr v's .17hmr

[aushunter]

Hi all, I'm about to purchase a new CZ varmint rimfire & can't decide which calibre to go with. I intended to shoot mainly foxes & rabbits 100mtrs(110yrds) out to 120mtrs(130yrds).
I'm yet to shoot either calibre so am looking for some feed back.
The .17 has a faster muzzle velocity but the light projectile weight of 17grains concerns me with knock down power.
Thanks

 

[Jimro]

Between the two I would choose the 22 WMR, there are more ammo choices to find the one your rifle likes the best. Either the 17 or the 22 will do for you at those ranges, but accuracy is more important than "knock down" power at any range.

Jimro

 

[precision_shooter]

Actually I think they are going to be pretty close in power. The 17 is lighter, but also much faster. The extra velocity makes for more energy to almost equal the 22 but with better accuracy. I have both but the 17 comes out with me more often than the 22. I've not shot a fox, but I have shot several racoons (about the same weight) and they never moved after being hit. My vote is for the 17.

 

[McClintock]

My standard answer... It depends.

In terms of knock-down power, by doing the math, the faster velocity of the 17 evens out (approximately) the heavier bullet of the 22 WMR. However, any amount of wind will definitely have more of an effect on the little 17-20 gr. pills the 17 uses, so if you need something that will buck wind a little better, you might want to consider the WMR. Ammo for the 22 Mag is cheaper (at least here, it is) than the HMR, too, but I don't know if that enters in to your equation or not.

That being said, the 17 is sure a hoot to use! I'd go for the 17, just for the fun factor if nothing else!

Hope that helps.

Cheers!
McClintock

 

[Scorch]

I own two 22 WMR rifles, and I like them fairly well. Having said that , I would recommend the 17HMR for the targets described. It shoots flatter, making range estimation very simple. It shoots faster, making wind deflection within your stated ranges minimal. And is typically very accurate, making those hard shots a higher probability of success.

 

[Come and take it.]

The .17s ballistic coefficient is higher than a 22 WMRs.

You will get less deflection from wind using the 17hmr.

 

[precision_shooter]

Just found some interesting info on Hornady's website.

17HMR
17gr. Vmax 100yds 200yds
___Velocity 1901 ...1378
___Energy ...136 ...72

20gr. HP
___Velocity 1776 ...1304
___Energy ...140 ...75


22WMR 30gr.
___Velocity 1421 ...1002
___Energy ...134 ...67

So it turns out that the 17 HMR even with the very light 17gr not only is faster but has a tad bit more energy than the 22WMR.

 

[LanceOregon]

The above data is very much incomplete, as it leaves out muzzle performance, where the 22 Magnum has an edge. So the impression that it gives is rather misleading.

And there are many other vendors making 22 magnum ammo. For example, Winchester's load with a 34 gr VMAX has 338 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle, and 155 ft/lbs at 100 yards.

The big edge that the 17 HMR has, though, is its far flatter trajectory, which really makes hitting small game much easier. It is also acknowledged as being far more inherently accurate. And bullet placement is always the biggest key in making a quick kill.

I would give the .22 magnum the edge out to 75 yards. Beyond that, the better accuracy and flatter trajectory of the 17 HMR make it the better round.

It is still just a 125 yard cartridge, though, in my opinion. If you are going to be doing a lot of shooting at 150 to 200 yards, then a centerfire cartridge is a much better choice than any rimfire.

--

 

[precision_shooter]

The above data is very much incomplete, as it leaves out muzzle performance, where the 22 Magnum has an edge. So the impression that it gives is rather misleading.

What does Muzzle Performance have anything to do with "knock down power" or Velocity at the range in which you intend to hit something? Nothing at all. All it does if give the Point Blank range performance of the cartridge. If im at point blank range, my .357 Mag or .44 Mag do the talking not a .17HMR or .22WMR.

 

[LanceOregon]

Then why do all ballistics tables then include muzzle figures? There was no good reason, in my opinion, to leave them out.

This is especially true for hunting small game like squirrels, rabbits, or foxes. I've shot way more rabbits and squirrels at under 50 yards than I have between 50 to 100 yards.

Rodents especially are not the smartest of animals. In cases where they have been under hunting pressure, though, they can become rather wary. But in those cases, one actually often ends up having to take 100 + yard shots. But that is when I break out the .223

--

 

[Come and take it.]

On the 22 WMRs advantage if you arent using 40 grain JHPs than you are missing the main advantage of the 22 magnum for a rimfire.

Momentum and bullet performance.

My favorite from many years ago was the Winchester 40 grain semi-jacketed hollowpoint.

On Kinetic energy versus momentum...

Ammo makers can save on lead (money in their pocket) if they can convince the consumer that a lighter weight projectile can deliver the same goods as a heavier, slower but higher momentum load. This is why Kinetic energy is listed on ballistic tables instead of momentum.

Energy comes in many forms after a bullet leaves the barrel, but the part of a projectiles energy that we should be most concerned about is momentum.

 

[Grim_Reaper]

I would and will take a .22WMR over a .17HMR any day myself.

 

[JohnKSa]

Ammo makers can save on lead (money in their pocket) if they can convince the consumer that a lighter weight projectile can deliver the same goods as a heavier, slower but higher momentum load. This is why Kinetic energy is listed on ballistic tables instead of momentum.

No, that is not why at all. Kinetic energy is a scientifically defined and experimentally verifiable quantity that defines the potential of a projectile to cause damage. Whether or not a projectile "lives up" to its potential is another story entirely.

Energy comes in many forms after a bullet leaves the barrel, but the part of a projectiles energy that we should be most concerned about is momentum.

Momentum is not a form of nor a part of energy. It, like energy, is a scientifically defined quantity that helps describe a moving object.

Together, momentum and kinetic energy provide insight into the projectile's potential to penetrate and cause damage.

 

[Lawyer Daggit]

I have two .22 Magnums and a .17 HMR.

The HMR is one of the most flat shooting rounds that I have ever used, it is however a poor killer compared to the .22 Magnum and is even more susceptible to wind than the .22 Magnum.

I would recommend that you get a good quality .22 Magnum.

Hopefully the introduction of the 17HMR will lead to 22 Magnum manufacturers upgrading the quality of projectile used in the Magnum, thereby overcoming the .22 Magnum's unjust reputation for indifferent accuracy.

 

[JohnKSa]

Where are you getting your wind drift figures for the 17HMR and the 22WMR to compare? I can't find a single reliable source that agrees with your assessment. Everything I can find indicates that the 17HMR is superior to the 22WMR in terms of wind drift--it drifts less. And that's exactly what I'd expect given the shorter time of flight for the faster 17HMR.

http://www.jesseshunting.com/articles/guns/category16/92.html

"Wind drift is less (than the .22WMR) with the 17 Hornady round..."​

http://www.cabelas.com/story-123/schoby_17_hmr_review/10201/.17%2BHMR%2BReview.shtml

"At 200 yards the .17 HMR drifts 15 inches less than a .22WMR in a 10-mph cross wind."​

http://www.chuckhawks.com/17HMR.htm

The .17 HMR was designed to outperform the .22 WMR in velocity and trajectory, and be less susceptible to wind drift.​

 

[Big G]

I own both and love both but when you get past about 75 or 80 yards the 22 mag hammers the critter harder than the hmr. Yes the hmr shoots flatter but if you shoot your 22 mag enough you will learn the trajectory.

 

[Three44s]

If your game were strictly wabbits ........ I'd say .... the .17 hmr

I am a bit concerned about Foxes and the .17 but in my opinion, I'd start with the wee one and if it does not pan out also get a .22 mag.

I own both .... the .22 mag in a Marlin (did the Rifle basix trigger on it) and a Savage in the .17 Hmr with an accutrigger.

Like another poster pointed out ...... I like a good 40 gr. JHP in the 22 mag as my rifle seems to not like the 30 gr. max speedsters past about 65 yds.

Good luck pickin'

And much enjoyment thereafter!

Three 44s

 

[aushunter]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. I think I've made up my mind.
Thanks for the links JonkSa they were very informative & swayed me to the
.17hmr.
I know if I need to go longer & harder all I need to do is pull out my
.22-250 remington.


Thanks everyone for the great advice.

 

[wpcexpert]

Penetration and Kill Factor

I have a personal situation to atest to the .17 performance. I had a stray dog in the area that kept jumping the fence and getting into the yard. He'd get into the trash, steal stuff and chew it up. I could never get to him to kill him, he was always one step ahead. We played this game for a while. Well I saw hime thru the window one afternoon. I stuck the barrel of my 17 out the dog door. This dog was a 60lb Rotty mix, he had a big head. At 45 paces, that 20gr game point went thru his scull and he twitched once. I didn't have any reservations about shooting it.

Also have killed pleanty of coons at 50-75 yds with it. Put out a pile of corn and take up a sniper position. Dead coon, small hole.

 

[JohnKSa]

At 45 paces, that 20gr game point went thru his scull and he twitched once. I didn't have any reservations about shooting it.

A good head shot is going to be pretty effective regardless of the caliber used, but I recall reading somewhere that for larger animals (coyote sized) the 20gr bullets seem to be a better choice than the lighter 17gr pills.

I'm NOT saying that the .17HMR is a good coyote caliber, just passing along some hearsay comparing the 17gr bullets to the 20gr bullets in that caliber.