2011s. 1911 double stack
- Thread starter BoogieMan
- Start date
buckhorn_cortez
New member
You'll have to define "too heavy" as some people carry full size stainless steel 1911's daily.
Of course a 2011 weighs more - it carries more rounds than a 1911. They're comparable to a SIG in weight.
Whether they're practical or not for carry depends upon you and the model chosen. An STI Guardian is made to be a carry gun. It's a 9mm with a 3.9-inch barrel. The smallest magazine (120mm) holds 15.
If you have the money, SVI will basically make whatever you want, including a titanium (Tiki-T) carry gun.
The problem (in my estimation) with the STI guns is the magazines. I have six 140mm magazines and three 170mm magazines. Everyone of them needed some work on the feed lips and followers to make them feed reliably. Once I "tweaked' them - they've been used regularly for practice and in competitions with zero problems.
The gun I have is a DVC Limited and it is a very finely made gun. It is in the same league as an Ed Brown, Les Baer, etc. for manufacturing precision, features, and fitting. The difference is that you cannot order special options - the gun comes in one configuration - that's it.
If you want a totally custom 2011, then you need to step up to SVI.
Of course a 2011 weighs more - it carries more rounds than a 1911. They're comparable to a SIG in weight.
Whether they're practical or not for carry depends upon you and the model chosen. An STI Guardian is made to be a carry gun. It's a 9mm with a 3.9-inch barrel. The smallest magazine (120mm) holds 15.
If you have the money, SVI will basically make whatever you want, including a titanium (Tiki-T) carry gun.
The problem (in my estimation) with the STI guns is the magazines. I have six 140mm magazines and three 170mm magazines. Everyone of them needed some work on the feed lips and followers to make them feed reliably. Once I "tweaked' them - they've been used regularly for practice and in competitions with zero problems.
The gun I have is a DVC Limited and it is a very finely made gun. It is in the same league as an Ed Brown, Les Baer, etc. for manufacturing precision, features, and fitting. The difference is that you cannot order special options - the gun comes in one configuration - that's it.
If you want a totally custom 2011, then you need to step up to SVI.
Mrgunsngear
New member
That's been my experience as well
Of my dozen STI pistols 5 are 2011s. As to weight they do have at least two models (Tactical and Guardian) offered with alloy frames. Combine the alloy frame and polymer grip and it shaves some weight. Of course you're now carrying additional rounds which adds back some weight. While I've never weighed them fully loaded, empty my Tactical 4.0 (with a full rail) weighs less than my single stack STI Ranger. Both are 4.15".
On the issue of magazine reliability I've seen similar comments to those mentioned here. Maybe I've been extraordinarily lucky, but I've never had feeding issues with the mags. I have about 18 2011 mags in 9mm, 40S&W, and .45 ACP have yet to have any feeding issues. This is going back 10 years to when I bought my first STI 2011. I shoot and Edge (USPSA Limited) and an Eagle (IDPA ESP) in competition so the mags get more use than just plinking at the range. I DO NOT try and tamper with them in order to get an extra round or two crammed in them for competition as some do. I'm not saying that folks haven't had legit issues, but simply that I've run a lot of rounds through 2011 magazines without problems.
On the issue of magazine reliability I've seen similar comments to those mentioned here. Maybe I've been extraordinarily lucky, but I've never had feeding issues with the mags. I have about 18 2011 mags in 9mm, 40S&W, and .45 ACP have yet to have any feeding issues. This is going back 10 years to when I bought my first STI 2011. I shoot and Edge (USPSA Limited) and an Eagle (IDPA ESP) in competition so the mags get more use than just plinking at the range. I DO NOT try and tamper with them in order to get an extra round or two crammed in them for competition as some do. I'm not saying that folks haven't had legit issues, but simply that I've run a lot of rounds through 2011 magazines without problems.
buckhorn_cortez
New member
Look very carefully at the feed lips on your magazines. About 1/16-inch down the tube from the feed lips' edges, you should see a small indented line parallel to the feed lips for the length of the feed lips.
This line indented into the tube is where the tool bends the feed lips to shape over a mandrel. On magazines with misshaped feed lips, you will see that the indented line is not the same depth for the length of the feed lips.
In fact, I have magazines where the line is very deep at the back of the tube and not even visible at the front of the feed lip on one side of the tube only. The other side of the tube will have a line that is indented differently.
The best that I can figure is that either the tool turned very slightly or the tube turned slightly on the mandrel during the forming process. This bends the feed lips unevenly.
On magazines with feed lips that formed correctly, the line is the same depth on both side of the tube from the front to back of the feed lips.
I have 9mm magazines. The magazines I have would run FMJ round nose bullets. They would not run 147 grain FMJ with the flat nose. If the feed lips are reverse tapered, that is, wider at the back and narrower at the front, the cartridge is tipped downward very slightly when it is at the top of the magazine and held by the feed lips.
On the 147 grain bullet, the corner formed where the flat meplat meets the ogive would catch on the feed ramp, flipping the bullet out of the magazine base up - which, of course, jammed the gun.
When the feed lip opening is tapered correctly (wider at the front and narrower at the back) the cartridge feeds tipped slightly up. This aims the bullet directly at the center of the barrel and allows the slide to strip the round directly from the magazine into the chamber.
To correct the taper, I used the Dawson magazine tuning kit mandrel, several brass hammers, the Dawson magazine pliers, and a pair of Knipex smooth jaw assembly pliers.
The second problem I had was with the followers. All of the followers had plastic molding flash (small fringes of plastic) hanging off various parts of the followers. This would cause the follower to bind in the tube depending upon the interior size of the tube.
The final problem was the tube itself. The tubes are welded on the front, interior of the tube and you can see the seam if you look carefully. Seven out of the nine magazines I have did not have the weld seam ground flat at the top of the tube.
There was a little bump at the very top on the interior of the tube. This problem combined with the flash on the plastic follower caused the follower to intermittently stick in the tube and not reliably lock the slide open when the magazine was empty.
The solution was to take out the follower and sand all of the flash off of it and flatten the weld seam bump on the interior of the tube. Once this was done, all of the magazines would lock the slide open when empty because the follower could smoothly travel to the top of the tube and lift the slide lock lever.
It took about 20-30 minutes per magazine to correct the feed lips, smooth the interior of the tube weld seam, and dress the followers.
The magazines will reliably feed mixed loads (115, 124, 147 grain) cartridges with different bullet shapes and will always lock the slide open.
I don't mind tweaking things, and the required modifications are straight forward as you can easily see the problems and also see when everything is working correctly.
I may have gotten a badly QC'd batch of magazines, I have no idea. I do know that if you saw the magazines I have before I worked on them, I could show you every problem with them and easily demonstrate intermittent feed problems and slide lock problems.
I could also rectify the problems as you watched and demonstrate full functionality when finished.
I'm glad all your magazines worked for you, but I think as you can see, I'm not making all of this up, as I can describe the problems in detail and how to fix each of the problems.
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Very nice work, Buckhorn...sounds like you've got some real talent there. I've tried "fixing" a cpl 1911 magazines for my standard 1911's over the years with ZERO success. All were damaged when dropped in the shop, one through a bush hog, and one rolled on by a 1000 lb. horse. Long story with those last two...but I'll save it for another day.
Being an old (50+ years with 1911's) fan of the Browning masterpiece, I hate to admit there's a new pistola under the sun (at least new to me). Recently, however, a LGS pal offered me a Sig P220 in .45 that really wound my clock. DA/SA like most Sig's of my experience, it had a DA pull that's far better than any of my treasured S&W revolvers and a SA pull that's right at 4.5 lbs.
It's a single stack (a better grip for my old slab side, loving hands), carries 8 in the mag. and one in the tube for a total of 9. For someone who likes the idea of revolver simplicity (pull the trigger and it goes bang w/o messing with a cocked hammer and safety disengagement routine, it would appear to be about perfect.
The gun is nickel finished from the factory, German made, and barely used. A real find I guess as they go on GB for quite a bit more than I gave him. It came with 5 mags too...all Sig factory provided.
Here's the obligatory pic with my Sig 1911 RCS. A nice pair to be sure.
Not quite the 12-15 round mag capacity DA auto some would like..but 9 rounds of .45 are nothing to sneeze at either.
Best Regards, Rod
Being an old (50+ years with 1911's) fan of the Browning masterpiece, I hate to admit there's a new pistola under the sun (at least new to me). Recently, however, a LGS pal offered me a Sig P220 in .45 that really wound my clock. DA/SA like most Sig's of my experience, it had a DA pull that's far better than any of my treasured S&W revolvers and a SA pull that's right at 4.5 lbs.
It's a single stack (a better grip for my old slab side, loving hands), carries 8 in the mag. and one in the tube for a total of 9. For someone who likes the idea of revolver simplicity (pull the trigger and it goes bang w/o messing with a cocked hammer and safety disengagement routine, it would appear to be about perfect.
The gun is nickel finished from the factory, German made, and barely used. A real find I guess as they go on GB for quite a bit more than I gave him. It came with 5 mags too...all Sig factory provided.
Here's the obligatory pic with my Sig 1911 RCS. A nice pair to be sure.
Not quite the 12-15 round mag capacity DA auto some would like..but 9 rounds of .45 are nothing to sneeze at either.
Best Regards, Rod
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rt11002003
New member
My shooting buddy has a Para that he swears by. I've shot it several times; it's a nice 2011. I have a STI 2011 MatchMaster. It's not your usual dual stack 1911. I think you'd call it a "race" gun. It's an incredible performer.
But, STI makes good guns, whether 1911, or 2011. I also have their RangeMaster and TargetMaster.
My experience with double stack and single stack pistols shows two things. The double stack models have wide grips resulting in a different feel. But, the feel doesn't seem to affect how well I shoot them. 1911's feel better to me, more natural, but I don't shoot them any better.
But, STI makes good guns, whether 1911, or 2011. I also have their RangeMaster and TargetMaster.
My experience with double stack and single stack pistols shows two things. The double stack models have wide grips resulting in a different feel. But, the feel doesn't seem to affect how well I shoot them. 1911's feel better to me, more natural, but I don't shoot them any better.
I had a hi-cap Springfield, not exactly a "2011", and closer to a Para.
Being all-steel it was pretty heavy, and I had some issues with reliable feeding, but some of that was due to trying to maximize capacity for competition.
An STI 2011 that is not weighed-down with a bull barrel, giant competition magwell, full-length guide rod, etc., will weigh less than an all-steel single stack, and fully-loaded - 15 rounds vice 9 rounds - I'd expect them to be about the same.
Being all-steel it was pretty heavy, and I had some issues with reliable feeding, but some of that was due to trying to maximize capacity for competition.
An STI 2011 that is not weighed-down with a bull barrel, giant competition magwell, full-length guide rod, etc., will weigh less than an all-steel single stack, and fully-loaded - 15 rounds vice 9 rounds - I'd expect them to be about the same.