1911 gurus - Another tech question...

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kayakersteve

New member
Recently, my Colt Defender has stopped locing back after last round is fired. Gun has 2-3l thousand rounds through it with no real issues up to this point. Does on all magazines. Is that a problem with the plunger tube? Mine seems a little loose. Any tips?
 
C

Creeper

New member
Sounds possible. Cycle the gun with a empty magazine while looking thru the ejection port with adequate lighting. See the relationship of the follower, and how it pushes the lug on the slide stop up... to lock the slide back?

If the slide stop detent plunger and/or housing is having issues, it can restrict the movement of the slide stop. Repeat the process described, and look at the plunger assembly and it's relationship to the slide stop... what do you see?

It may be, as you have theorized, that the plunger housing will need to be re-staked, or replaced.

You may also have a damaged slide stop lever assy. It could be bent, or exceedingly loose and the lug is not being engaged by the magazine follower.

Cheers,
C

A bit of an addendum here: I'm making certain assumptions that your gun and magazines are clean and in good condition.
 
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K

kayakersteve

New member
Thanks for reply - Based on how loose the plunger tube is, I will try re-staking that first. From what I can tell, the slide stop appears to be in good shape.
 
D

drail

Moderator
Having staked a load of plunger tubes I can tell you restaking it will be a temporary fix. The reason it came loose is still going to be there. The tubes legs have to be long enough to go all the way through your frame and the inside holes have to be chamfered enough to allow the legs to swage out like a rivet. Buy a brand name tube like EGW or Wislon or Brown and have it properly staked. It will never come off again. A loose plunger tube can lock the gun up when loaded and on safe. It is a critical part. It has to be tight.
 
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kayakersteve

New member
Good info - I am trying to re-stake it and realize is likley temporary. I did order a new plunger tube from colt, but you have me wondering if I should have gone with a different brand??
 
C

Creeper

New member
I did order a new plunger tube from colt, but you have me wondering if I should have gone with a different brand??
Click to expand...

I'd be a bit more concerned about damage... if you don't have one of the common plunger tube staking tools. You can do it without a tool, but it's way easier with. The tools provide proper support and an even, centered press or strike.

Depending on the brand, type and relative "ease of use" they run from about $25 to $75. Look in Brownells... they should have most of them listed.

Cheers,
C
 
C

Creeper

New member
I don't know what you have for tooling. The frame and tube need to be supported so that you don't mar the frame or dent the tube... and that the tube is held firmly against the frame.
If the tube moves when you peen the pins, you can ruin the part, and perhaps even damage the frame.

The insides don't have to look perfect, but you want a good center peen on the pins so that the surrounding displaced metal is even, thick and un-cracked... actually, when it's done right, it does look pretty perfect. :p

Cheers,
C
 
K

kayakersteve

New member
@creeper - Gotcha - I just took the gun apart and in addition to the loose plunger tube, the slide stop is broken off where it would engage the slide. No visible damage to slide or frame. Trying to decide on repair myself or sending back to Colt. I think I can do the plunger tube as I have a plunger stake tool coming and it seems straight forward. Pondering replacing slide stop and trying to re-stake tube and seeing what I have.

In the meantime, I have broken out my Sig C3 1911 for my carry gun.

DO YOU THINK THE SLIDE STOP OFF OF THE SIG C3 OR MY DELTA ELITE WOULD SWAP INTO THE DEFENDER?? Just trying to speed things up.
 
C

Creeper

New member
Don't know if your Defender is under warranty or not. If you have the part and the tool coming... might as well do it yourself.

I believe the slide stop on a 10mm Delta Elite (or .38 Super) is a bit different from that used in a .45... in that the lug extends out (or in depending how you think about it) a bit further to engage the narrower magazine feed ramp, and may require modification to get it to work in a .45.
You can certainly do a "stare and compare"... same with the SIG, for which I do not have the slightest clue. :eek:

Cheers,
C
 
A

Aguila Blanca

Staff
kayakersteve said:
DO YOU THINK THE SLIDE STOP OFF OF THE SIG C3 OR MY DELTA ELITE WOULD SWAP INTO THE DEFENDER?? Just trying to speed things up.
Click to expand...
It will fit into the Defender. Function tests:

Remove slide and barrel. Insert slide stop in frame.

1) Be sure slide stop is pushed down. Insert EMPTY magazine into mag well. Watch to see if the follower engages the slide stop lug and pushes the stop up.

2) Be sure slide stop is pushed down. Insert LOADED magazine into mag well -- slowly (you may have to manually depress the mag catch to avoid a jump as it engages the magazine). Watch closely as the bullet comes up past the slide stop lug. If the bullet mages contact with the lug, there's a possibility it will push it up when feeding, resulting in the slide locking open with rounds still in the magazine.

If you pass both tests, you should be good to go.
 
N

Nathan

New member
Have you changed rthe recoil spring? A small 1911 needs it's spring changed every 1000 to be reliable. Mag springs vary, but should be changed at this point also. Slide stop will likely need some fitting for this gun. Any 45 ACP should have the same one, not sure about other calibers, but likely the same. That said, it may need to be fitted and then it won't be fit to the other gun.
 
D

drail

Moderator
Make sure you remember to fill the new tube with some kind of pin or drill rod before you squeeze it.
 
K

kayakersteve

New member
Slide stop off delta elite was identicle - checks as described above work - thanks. I will re-stake the existing pluger tube now and then if/when loosens up again, put the new one on. My gun was under a 'warranty', but I would have to pay shipping there overnight and the plunger tube was only 12.00, so I will try it myself first.

Thanks for tips on plunger tube - all duly noted.
 
R

RsqVet

New member
In an ideal world thd grip panel should support the plunger tube reducing stress on the stake job. If this is not the Case you may want to change grips or build up some material on top of grip to give support. Epoxy is a workable if indelicate solution.

I always prep with solvent the frame and tube prior to staking, I believe this leads to a more secure job, no oil to interfear or be displaced when staking. Sounds silly but the ones I have done that failed were when I was in a rush and omitted this step
 
C

Creeper

New member
Post your findings when you get it sorted. It would be a good thread for others to consider when encountering a similar problem.

Cheers,
C
 
K

kayakersteve

New member
UPDATE

I took it apart and cleaned and degreased real good. The old plunger tube came off easily with a pointed scre driver in it and a gentle tug. Again cleaned and the new plunger tube was locktighted and set in place - a metal rod (snug) was placed into tube. My new staking tool was used to easily stake it in place. I turned it one full turn from when it was snug. The tube is on very tight and no movement now. The internals and thumb safety are back on. Can't totally reassemble as my slide is off to Novaks for tijicon installation. Hopefully will have back together by end of week.

For now, having to get used to carrying a commander size 1911 (Sig C3), but my new XDs should be here by Wednesday. If all goes well, I am sure the Xds will get a lot of carry time
 
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