Just heard a story on the radio about a hunting "accident" in Wyandot county Ohio, in which a 12 year old boy collapsed and subsequently died after firing a 410 shotgun at a deer with his dad nearby. Supposedly the recoil of the shotgun caused his heart to stop according to a doctor. Something about a trauma when the heart nerves are repolarising during the heartbeat cycle can cause a rare heart failure. I would link the story but not sure how to transfer the link to here. It is on the WTVN.com website if anyone cares to read it. So maybe giving high recoiling guns to kids to shoot is not such a good idea? But you would think a 410 would be pretty light?
12 year old dies from recoil?
- Thread starter Tom2
- Start date
No maybe to it. Have seen two examples this year but no one got hurt. It's always impossible to explain or accept such accidents. I personally work with my Grandkids and got a bit critical when our Son-in-Law took our 11 year old Grandson out and the first shotgun he shot was a 20 Ga., 3" magnum at ducks. I had already broke him in on a .410 and after that, he didn't want to shoot that either. We got to remember that at this age, it has to be fun. Yes, we can burn out our kids real fast when we try to push it. Bad part is, I gave them the 20Ga. and let his dad take it home. I have a 12Ga. waiting in the wings but will keep this till "I" know he is ready. Thanks for the post???
It is a RARE event
The trauma to the heart during re-polarization will cause the heart to stop beating. This is an extremely rare event but it does happen. It is a combination of the recoil or trauma and the precise time the heart "resets" or re-polarizes. A "1 in a million" type of event.
I've tired to reduce the recoil of my 11 yr old stepsons 20 ga by adding a butt stock pad and a padded vest when he shoots. It will be a while before he is ready for the 12 gauge.
The trauma to the heart during re-polarization will cause the heart to stop beating. This is an extremely rare event but it does happen. It is a combination of the recoil or trauma and the precise time the heart "resets" or re-polarizes. A "1 in a million" type of event.
I've tired to reduce the recoil of my 11 yr old stepsons 20 ga by adding a butt stock pad and a padded vest when he shoots. It will be a while before he is ready for the 12 gauge.
I fired an old loose 20 ga. double with a hard thin buttplate when I was about 9 or 10, and it did not make me want to get into shotgunning at that time. Frankly I am not so hot on 12 ga. slugs with most factory pump setups(hard thin pad) Wonder if lefties are at more risk of the heart stopping from recoil? 
There is a complex dance of chemicals that cause the heart to contract (depolarize) During the pause between beats, there is a period where the heart is beginning to repolarize, lasting less than 1/4 second. A trauma to the heart during the second half of this period (called the relative refractory period) can cause the heart to enter a rhythm called ventricular fibrillation.
Not as rare as one would think, but a shock as slight as a small shotgun would be a rare cause for such an event. The fact that the coroner is releasing a finding only 2 days after the death is unusual and makes me suspect his methods. Toxicology isn't even back yet.
Not as rare as one would think, but a shock as slight as a small shotgun would be a rare cause for such an event. The fact that the coroner is releasing a finding only 2 days after the death is unusual and makes me suspect his methods. Toxicology isn't even back yet.
When I was a kid another kid was killed when a thrown baseball hit him in the chest
I have also heard of this happening in martial arts
recoil from a .410 seems a little light to have this effect, but I had my shoulder separated by an AR15 recoil recently
The human body is starnge
I have also heard of this happening in martial arts
recoil from a .410 seems a little light to have this effect, but I had my shoulder separated by an AR15 recoil recently
The human body is starnge
agree with most of the above.
while technically possible, its highly unlikely. divemedic makes a good point, awful quick decision from the coroner considering circumstances and age of the kid. I'm the deputy coroner in my county. I would be looking long and hard at this one.
but its like i tell my patients; "I never say never."
while technically possible, its highly unlikely. divemedic makes a good point, awful quick decision from the coroner considering circumstances and age of the kid. I'm the deputy coroner in my county. I would be looking long and hard at this one.
but its like i tell my patients; "I never say never."
Chest impacts can stop the heart.
But I've never heard of it from a shoulder-fired weapon.
Not unless the lower corner of the stock impacts the nerve ganglia in the armpit. One wonders if the kid was holding the gun properly.
When I played baseball as a youngster, one of my teamates hit a terrific line-drive with a lot of power behind it for a 13 y/o player. The ball struck the shortstop square in the chest and he dropped like a dropped sack of potatoes. One of the coaches checked him and used the old precordial-strike maneuver which brought him out of fibrillation. His folks took him to the hospital and about a week later he was pretty well over it.
As a contrast, years later, I spoke to a local police officer who'd been shot in the vest, squarely over his heart, at contact distance with a .44 Mag. Despite a fracture to his sternum, no loss of awareness but he did manage to grab the gun and empty his .357 into the perp. Apparently what went through his mind was that the SOB picked the day he was going to propose to his girl and he didn't want to propose in the hospital.
But I've never heard of it from a shoulder-fired weapon.
Not unless the lower corner of the stock impacts the nerve ganglia in the armpit. One wonders if the kid was holding the gun properly.
When I played baseball as a youngster, one of my teamates hit a terrific line-drive with a lot of power behind it for a 13 y/o player. The ball struck the shortstop square in the chest and he dropped like a dropped sack of potatoes. One of the coaches checked him and used the old precordial-strike maneuver which brought him out of fibrillation. His folks took him to the hospital and about a week later he was pretty well over it.
As a contrast, years later, I spoke to a local police officer who'd been shot in the vest, squarely over his heart, at contact distance with a .44 Mag. Despite a fracture to his sternum, no loss of awareness but he did manage to grab the gun and empty his .357 into the perp. Apparently what went through his mind was that the SOB picked the day he was going to propose to his girl and he didn't want to propose in the hospital.
"Hard to believe that the recoil of a .410 to the shoulder would cause the heart to stop. Wonder what the national incidence of kids' dying from cardiac arrest while shooting .410s is? Anybody know?"
You can bet that it would be in the too small to measure category. Freak accidents happen. The 2 year old child of one of my wife’s friends tripped in their living room. He got up, and resumed playing without even crying. The rest of the day was "normal". Parents found him dead in bed the next morning. Days later, autopsy said it was a brain hemorrhage caused by the shock of the fall. Sad, but what can you do ? Wrap the kids in foam, keep ‘em inside under guard and take ‘em to the doctor every time they get a scrape?
I saw a kid dropped by a line drive baseball to the chest. He was hit squarely in the solar plexus… dunno about his heart but it took a while for his breathing to normalize. He recovered "on the bench".
A buddy of mine had a heart transplant and the doctor told him to refrain from shooting anything for at least 6 - 8 months … including a .22 target pistol ! He lasted about 3 or 4 weeks before he couldn’t stand it anymore and was in the pistol pit.
The first time I shot a 12 ga. was at 8 or 9 yrs. Win. model 1911 ... kicked like an sob with #1 buck. Had my own 12ga. when I was 12 yrs (birthday present) and killed several deer with it. ... no problems...
You can bet that it would be in the too small to measure category. Freak accidents happen. The 2 year old child of one of my wife’s friends tripped in their living room. He got up, and resumed playing without even crying. The rest of the day was "normal". Parents found him dead in bed the next morning. Days later, autopsy said it was a brain hemorrhage caused by the shock of the fall. Sad, but what can you do ? Wrap the kids in foam, keep ‘em inside under guard and take ‘em to the doctor every time they get a scrape?
I saw a kid dropped by a line drive baseball to the chest. He was hit squarely in the solar plexus… dunno about his heart but it took a while for his breathing to normalize. He recovered "on the bench".
A buddy of mine had a heart transplant and the doctor told him to refrain from shooting anything for at least 6 - 8 months … including a .22 target pistol ! He lasted about 3 or 4 weeks before he couldn’t stand it anymore and was in the pistol pit.
The first time I shot a 12 ga. was at 8 or 9 yrs. Win. model 1911 ... kicked like an sob with #1 buck. Had my own 12ga. when I was 12 yrs (birthday present) and killed several deer with it. ... no problems...
TargetTerror
New member
This same phenomenon happened in a town in the greater Boston area a few years ago. A kid was playing hockey, got checked, and his heart stopped.
It's rare, but it does happen.
It's rare, but it does happen.
MD_Willington
New member
Well, my wife's friend had a little boy with a heart defect, he simply fell over at the playground and hit his chest, he died pretty much on the spot... freak accident. So I could see it happening.
So I could see it happening.Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Not really the same thing, but there was a case of a young boy in TX firing a 454 Casull revolver that recoiled the barrel into his head and killed him, IIRC.
It was in the papers so not an urban myth.
It was in the papers so not an urban myth.
Why is this only affecting boys? I don't have any daughters and don't have sisters so I'm wondering, do most girls just stare at their dolls all day? My neighbor has a houseful of young daughters and true enough, they don't do much but follow each other around and watch the other kids in the neighborhood.
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